Non-Drop frame Errors with 24P, HDW1800 and Nitris

[Ryan Megan]

I think I’ve narrowed my problem down to a deck issue. BUt would still like feedback from anyone whom as working knowlege of the HDW1800.

We’ve been using the JH3 in 23.98 (with pulldown) mode to digitize the offline footage. This deck has a setting for drop or non-drop. It seems the HDW-1800 although allows you to apply drop down, does not allow you to select “drop frame” it’s stuck in “non-drop frame”.

I may have to just use the JH3 for onlines I guess. But feel a bit swindled as I was promised by my deck dealer this deck would handle my workflow just fine. Now with the shows cutting using the footage in drop frame, I can’t really online it in non-drop frame.

Again any ideas or feedback would help.

[Adam Polanger]

From the Sony Product Page on the HDW-1800.
https://tinyurl.com/29cqrf

“Pulldown output is not available in this model”

You digitized all your 24p source tapes at 59.94i (with pulldown). You need a deck like the HDW-F500 with the HKDV507D pulldown board installed. Here is some more info:
https://tinyurl.com/ys64jy

Without pulldown, the timecode and video coming out of the HDW-1800 will not be usable in a 59.94i project.

Using the HDW-F500 with pulldown you can convert video and timecode to 30i DF or NDF
You will need to set these menu items
Timecode Sense Select 24p/30i
Pulldown Control DF/NDF
This will match the way you digitized the J-H3.

[Adam Polanger]

I hope this might help you.

From the Sony Product Page on the HDW-1800.
https://tinyurl.com/29cqrf

“Pulldown output is not available in this model”

You digitized all your 24p source tapes at 59.94i (with pulldown). You need a deck like the HDW-F500 with the HKDV507D pulldown board installed. Here is some more info:
https://tinyurl.com/ys64jy

Without pulldown, the timecode and video coming out of the HDW-1800 will not be usable in a 59.94i project.

Using the HDW-F500 with pulldown you can convert video and timecode to 30i DF or NDF
You will need to set these menu items
Timecode Sense Select 24p/30i
Pulldown Control DF/NDF
This will match the way you digitized the J-H3.

You were swindled by your deck dealer. If you want a more knowledgeable dealer let me know.

[Derrick Abeyta]

Did you try going in the main menu page? try pressing P1 (home), then P5 (page down) and then you should see F4 drop/non drop. Hope this helps.

BTW, I was having the same problem when I first purchased the HDW D1800 deck. I was used to editing with the JH3.

Derrick

[Adam Polanger]

The info I linked to seems to be out of date.
There is a board called HKDW-104 that will give you 59.94i video & timecode if it is installed in your deck.

Here is the manual:

https://bssc.sel.sony.com/BroadcastandBusiness/minisites/cinealta/docs/hkdw104_opMan.pdf
(English starts on page 8)

I’ve never seen the deck but I am assuming you want menu items

013 SYSTEM FREQUENCY SELECT set to 23.98PD1
018 ACTIVE LINE SELECT set to OFF
217 PULLDOWN TIMECODE SENSE set to ON

There is no PULLDOWN CONTROL item like on the other deck, hopefully the pulldown timecode sense will default to DF like on the J-H3.

[Scott Cumbo]

check the deck template in the avid, make sure it has 24p.
example HDWF50024p… you may have to manualy adjust it by
using the adjust deck option.
if an 1800 template isn’t available you can use the 500 template.

also, I know that their is a firmware upgrade for some of the 1800 decks, you may want to give sony a call. We’ve ran across a bunch of issue’s with our 1800.

good luck.

Scott Cumbo
Editor
Broadway Video, NYC

[Ryan Megan]

thanks for the suggestions guys, really appreciate it. If none of this works I guess I’ll try to get Sony on the horn.

The deck was sold (allegedly) with a card in it that allows pulldown – and sure enough there is an option for 23.98 with pulldown. I thought the 24p deck templates only showed up when in a 24p project. When I have the system frequency set to 59.94 the menu has an option for Drop/non drop. But the option vanishes when I switch modes.

[Earle Nichol]

Hey guys, I just went thru a similar situation with our HDW-1800. Ours was an issue of getting a 59.94 timeline out of a 29.97 offline that had 23.98 source tapes. We should have just done the offline in HD(learned lesson) but with budgets and stuff and graphics to take into consideration, it is, what it is. Anyways, now with our 29.94 timeline and our 23.98 source tapes I thought we were in for a heap load of pain,(and I did try to figure it out over the weekend, with no luck) Anyways with the info that you posted I was able to walk in this morning, tweak our deck and get a 59.94 timeline for our client. After all my blithering, I just wanted to say thanks for the posting Adam, it saved our(my) butt. I LOVE THE COW!!!

pearl

Communication, Communication, Communication!!!

[Ryan Megan]

Thanks for all the help guys.

I ended up talking it through with a Sony tech – there were a few other deck settings in the menu that had to be tweaked that weren’t mentioned here. I was in such a flux I didn’t have time to jot them down. But I would say if the information posted here doesn’t get you all the way there give the Sony guys a call, the guy I spoke with was very pleasant and helpful.