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Node connection too picky?
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WHAT ?
haha, I am sooo happy I finally have nodes where I can rearrange things, plan my structure and don’t have to deal with layers or scaffolds or whatever which do not interact properly when drastic changes have been made. The whole parallel node topology is killer ! Not to speak about mixing masks and blending grades.
Ok, I think its time I share my “Wunderbaum” 🙂https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/277/8353
A slice of color…
DaVinci 8.0.1 OSX 10.7
MacPro 5.1 2×2,4 24GB
RAID0 8TB eSata 6TB
GTX 470 / GT 120
Extreme 3D+ WAVE -
DaVinci Resolve have been advertised by BMD as a node based color grading software, so now you’re complaining that it doesn’t use layers?
A nightmare to use? The whole interface is counterintuitive and counterproductive? Seriously???
Best,
Peace Villow -
Yes, seriously. Look at any other top notch color grading systems- Baselight, Lustre, Filmmaster. They all use layers. Do you think they don’t know what they are doing? Look at photoshop. Is photoshop using nodes? Nodes are great for shots, where you can spend hours and days finessing one shot. Color grading is all about artistic creativity and speed. Yes, speed…
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i am with you here on this, but i have found a solution to what was actually my problem. if you think of nodes as really nothing more than plug ins of say an audio mixer then it starts to make sense…in logic for instance, everytime you add an effect to the mixer bus you’re really just adding another node. it all comes down to which node goes where…..in logic i had to learn that the eq plug in worked better if it went before the compressor…the same in resolve..you just gotta figure out the best way to line them up. one of the limiting things about color was if you had several secondaries opened you couldnt insert another effect in between 2 secondaries…it was either at the end or you left space at the beginning. in alot of ways the node way of working is not that different from the color efx room in color where you had to build your own “tree”. i never really liked the color fx room for that reason because sometimes it wasnt clear which effect would go where and it was alot of trial and error if you dont have a logical mind(which i sometimes don’t)…being able to insert a node in between 2 others is a very powerful tool when you come to grips with the way it works. still i wish there was a dedicated secondaries room similar to color where you can just stack (layer) your corrections….even tho photoshop is layer based you can still move the order of the layers around and that is essentially what nodes are! keep trying until the light goes on and it will all become clear to you!
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[jake blackstone] “Look at any other top notch color grading systems- Baselight, Lustre, Filmmaster. They all use layers. Do you think they don’t know what they are doing?”
Do you think DaVinci guys have no idea what they’re doing???
Best,
Peace Villow -
Interesting Kim. As you, neither did I like the Color FX room in Color. It was confusing and felt more like a compositor than a color correction tool.
I like having nodes for the grading. Finding the correct node comes with experience and habits. I usually start with a node to make the image neutral, then on the next nodes I have ‘secondaries’. In the end I put the overall color adjustments, vignettes and if needed, some more exposure control.
Now, that’s just me. It might not be logical for anyone else. But if you stick to habits, you will instantly know what node you need to adjust in a shot.
Kim gives a good comparison. Nodes isn’t much different from layers. It’s just the way it’s represented in the GUI. Well, not only that – but essentially if you’re not going to do too advanced stuff, that’s what you need to know.
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Perhaps all we need is the ability to name nodes, just like we can name stills in the gallery. That would demystify what each node did when coming back to the project.
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That would be a start, but it still doesn’t answer the question how to know what had been done on the particular node. For example, you’d need to click on every tab of the selected node, to find what was used. It’s fine, if you’re doing it during a session, but what if you need to revisit something that you had done 3 months ago? Why not a pop up on a node, like Baselight, where it shows what had been done to that node? Then from that pop up you could choose what you want to selectively copy from that node. Right now all you can do is to copy the whole node…
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One suggestion I made to BM during beta testing was to bold the tabs that had been used – I agree that right now, trying to figure out which curves are used on which node is a bit of a pain.
But I’m still not convinced of a need for a paradigm shift. In many cases the node thumbnail reveals a lot of information about key/window that’s on it. With some labels, and maybe even the popup overview you mentioned, revisiting a grade is easy enough.
I’m still not quite sure what about layers vs nodes makes it more intuitive. But you’ll have to forgive me – I’ve not worked with a layer based coloring software.
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Right now Resolve is still a bit bare creative wise, when it comes to controls and effects. Even with existing minimal controls, Resolve is still difficult to get around. FilmMaster has much more in terms of creative tools and plugins and to see what was used is a breeze. Just look at the picture, I provided here:
https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/277/8437
You have here 12layers or “nodes” with effects and controls and anyone with a glance can see what was done. It will take you probably 5 minutes to try to figure out the same on Resolve, provided Resolve could even do many of controls and effects, that are not there.
And, it’s not just a session management, it’s an ability to copy a single or multiple elements, without a need to copy the whole node/layer thing.
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