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  • New forum name!

  • Michael Hancock

    May 29, 2020 at 8:09 pm

    I just realized that the name of this forum has changed from FCPX Debates to Creative Community Conversations. Nice!

    Michael Hancock

  • David Mathis

    May 29, 2020 at 8:51 pm

    Let the debates begin! ????

    In all seriousness, the new name is great. Hoping for a healthy and lively discussion without the food fights in the past. Tim must have snuck out of his evil doctor secret laboratory when we weren’t looking. ????

    I am an Avid fan of making the Final Cut on Resolve so the video will not be boring.

  • Craig Seeman

    May 30, 2020 at 2:57 am

    FCPX 10.5 will come out and all hell will break loose again.

  • David Roth Weiss

    May 30, 2020 at 4:50 am

    The old name was imperfect, but the new name will never attract a new visitor. It’s completely meaningless and has zero industry recognition. Other than that, it’s perfect.

    David Roth Weiss
    Director/Editor/Colorist & Workflow Consultant
    David Weiss Productions
    Los Angeles

    David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro Legacy forum.

  • Tim Wilson

    June 2, 2020 at 8:09 am

    I’ve repeated the story of the original name of the forum often enough that I don’t need to do it again….maybe ever LOL….but the real problem with the name is that, in addition to no longer being vaguely applicable, it came to represent the opposite of everything we ever wanted from Creative COW.

    A place to argue? We NEVER wanted that. People who want that can get a bellyful at Reddit or Facebook or something. The purpose in creating the forum was strictly as a holding pen to keep the hoof and mouth disease from destroying the entire herd. Don’t forget that we had our first 200 posts here before that first NAB 2011 presentation was finished, and over 1000 by morning, with another 1000 that day — and none of them happy.

    We were delighted that the forum became such a better thing! It’s a testament to the COW’s REAL heritage of curiosity, creativity, empathy, and generosity of spirit that not even such a contentious origin would allow it to remain anything like that for long.

    The name became the biggest problem, in a dozen ways or more that I can rattle off from the top of my head. I’ll stop at three.

    1) It indicated that we thought debate was valuable for its own sake, which we emphatically do not.

    We could have stayed angry and argumentative at our old jobs for a lot more money. LOL We started the COW as a place of hope and help. We’re also glad to have a forum that expands on tha to include wild speculation and carefully considered takes on angles of the industry that transcend any particular toolsets.

    Not that there haven’t been number of folks over the years who engaged in debate for its own sake often enough. We’re likewise delighted to have helped them to the door to find more appropriate places to whip their adrenaline into a froth.

    2) It suggested a negative position toward FCPX.

    This was especially exasperating to me, who is plainly documented as FCPX’s earliest and most enthusiastic exponent in these halls, as indeed I championed Final Cut when it was still at Macromedia running on Windows. Also well documented in these pages, including my oft-posted photo of the CD-ROM of Macromedia Final Cut that I still have — and it lists Windows FIRST! As far as I have been able to determine, mine is the only photo of that original CD-ROM to have ever been posted online. Mine was certainly the first.

    Of course, many here have mocked me for my early enthusiasms, starting with my insistence that anything less than 10 million seats by the end of its first year should be considered a catastrophic failure, grounds for dismissing the entire marketing team. I believed it then, and kind of still do.

    Others of you have gotten downright furious at me for my enthusiastic support for Apple burning all the boats, and admitting that FCP was already EOL. I say “admitting” it was EOL because it WAS already EOL, as many of you had lamented here in the years when Apple was in retrospect clearly marking time until the next thing was ready. I’ve only become more convinced of that since then. Continuing the charade would have been an insult to everyone — and hey, if you still want a copy of FCP 7, they’ve got ’em at Amazon.

    Not to restart those debates, but to underscore — I don’t think anyone who has ever passed through this forum in the 9 years since it began can point to a stack of posts with more than a fraction of my unbridled enthusiasm for everything Apple was up to.

    So I took the suggestion that “the COW hates FCPX” personally. It’s not true, and never was. And certainly, a vibrant FCPX forum, and the best Motion resources on the web (thanks in large part to Simon’s tutorials!), and stories of FCPX projects like this one I wrote on Whisky Tango Foxtrot (where I suggested that FCPX would be the tool that finally moved Hollywood off Avid, that it would forever change VFX, AND that it would change the way movies are financed — OOOPS lol) — show there was just no basis for saying any such thing about how “the COW” felt about FCPX….except for our inability to shake the gol-dang NAME of the forum.

    3) Not only have we wanted to dim the light on “debate”, we’ve NEEDED to expand its charter beyond anything connected to FCPX.

    Look, we haven’t debated anything substantial in ages, and THAT’S GOOD. What’s not so good is that the roots of the forum are so deeply tied to FCPX, and only FCP.

    The things we talk about here SHOULD be engaged with by not just FCPX-ers and a handful of multi-tooled folks, but people whose ONLY tools are Premiere Pro, or After Effects, or VEGAS Pro, or Avid. Every conversation we’ve had here for years would have benefitted from MORE perspectives, including experiences that had nothing to do with FCPX….

    …but at least as important, would have benefitted from the input of even more FCPX-ers who didn’t want to be seen endorsing any kind of debate around something that was an unqualified positive force in their lives.

    I’d tried inviting folks from other parts of the COW who were looking for general conversation to drop by and take a look, and was told by some of them, “But I have no interest in talking about FCPX.” Not that they had any negative feelings either — just that, as a topic, it didn’t seem particularly interesting to them.

    There were other folks who said, “I avoid places on the web that debate things. That’s why I’m not on Facebook, Twitter, or Reddit.” This was equally true for people using FCPX and not. They come to the COW as a respite from debate.

    FAIR ENOUGH, both for folks who are into FCPX, and who aren’t. The forum name was offputting to them, and became intolerable to us.

    So those are just three reasons why the name had become a problem over the past few years. Anybody who came here for the name (“ooooh! Debate! Lemme in!”) was exactly the same kind of person that we’ve spent 25 years throwing out. We don’t want anything to do with them.

    I’m not saying that this name is the Be All and End All, mind you. Too many words, too many letters. Give me a better idea, and I’ll take it. But anyone with the idea that the old name was doing us ANY good simply hasn’t been paying attention. Talk about a debate not worth having!

    This is a whole ‘nother conversation, but seriously, anybody who says that really has no clue about the COW. We’ve got 800,000 people a month passing through here. It’s clear from the LACK of debate in our dozens of forums, including this one of late, that they haven’t been coming to debate.

    This particular forum also skews to be the oldest one in the bunch. A bunch of us here are in our 60s, when folks in our age group represents about 3% of our traffic overall. 71% of our readers are under 34, and half of them are women.

    More often, the old name was keeping out the kind of people we DO want here. Which is remarkably similar to the folks who ARE here, except that we want more of them. ☺ And more representative of EVERYONE who comes to the COW. And one way to do that is to decouple the forum NAME from one aspect (debate) of one NLE (FCPX).

    The forum itself has already done that, or course. We just needed the name to catch up.

    And frankly, as fond of the forum as we’ve been, we’ve intentionally kept some of the best threads off of our social media feeds and out of our newsletters because we had ZERO interest in propagating a wildly inappropriate name that was the opposite of everything that was important to us as community organizers. I tried sneaking around this by remapping some posts to our Business & Career Advice forum, or to the Art of The Edit forum (now absorbed into this one), and using those names to promote threads that originated HERE.

    The FORUM is dandy, and doesn’t need to change anything. The NAME needed to GO.

    Changing the name of the forum is just the first step. Changing those submenus at the top of the page to make this forum show up in ALL forums, not just under the FCP family, is next. (That’ll take a while.) It’ll NOW start being featured regularly in our feeds. Instead of keeping it off our front page, we’ll be featuring it in regular rotation with our other most popular forums, because the name reflects what the forum actually IS — a place to have conversations about anything related to creativity and the creative enterprise.

    In general, it’s silly to suggest that the authority of anything comes from its name. How does FRUIT apply to a computer? Or a phone? Ask Apple. What do mud bricks have to do with fonts or analytics or software? Ask Adobe. English-language books and a South American river? Wait a minute, and what do books have to do with food, lawnmowers, sex toys, and cloud servers? Ask Amazon.

    The world’s largest creative community and bovines? Well now THAT, I happen to know something about.

    A name is a name. The authority of a thing comes from the DOING of a thing. I like what we’re doing here. The old name was the opposite of everything important to us, and prevented us from achieving any of our goals for the forum’s future. The new name makes it at least possible. Now we have to keep doing it.

    I’m not worried, though. Those 800,000 people a month that come to, about 375,000 of whom pass through this very forum, will keep coming because Google sent them directly from a search to a thread. Those people never stopped to look at some list of forum names. They came STRAIGHT to a thread from a search.

    Hopefully more of those visitors will post when they see a forum name that shines light on what’s truly relevant to the proceedings, while leaving irrelevance, nonsense, and performative enmity further and further behind.

    Thanks to everyone who contributed such constructive suggestions for a new name in the previous thread, and even the playful ones. I’m sorry that this one doesn’t have a bovine pun…YET. I haven’t given up!


    Yr pal,

  • andy lewis

    June 2, 2020 at 2:58 pm

    “The Conversation”

    – It identifies the forum as different from all the others while describing what it is.
    – It has the perfect cinematic heritage.

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