More glum FCP news from the UK

[Bouke Vahl]

Now what are you trying to tell us?
If you’re a freelance editor, you need to cut.

Learn whatever it takes to do the stuff, stop complaining.
The interesting part of the trade is NOT in the tools.

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros

[Ben Holmes]

You didn’t really read my post, did you? Edit hire is a business for me, as well as for post houses.

I’ll use any system someone wants me to use – but investment in equipment is something else.

Even so – of course it matters where the industry is headed in terms if standards. If you want to spend your life just hiring yourself out to edit, carry on – I’d rather work on a future where I spend more time managing an edit business, and more time with my family.

Edit Out Ltd
—————————-
FCP Editor/Trainer/System Consultant
EVS/VT Supervisor for live broadcast
RED camera transfer/post
Independent Director/Producer

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[Bouke Vahl]

well,
I did read it, and i’m not stupid, and i also rent out equipment.
(check my track record)

And my statement still stands.

The actual rooms, coffee machine and monitors are more expensive than the machines nowadays.

Get an accountant and / or a spreadsheet, do the math. Stop bitching about how it ‘should be’ I myself am responsible for getting post cost down, as i am one of the first to embrace NLE’s (doing it for over 15 years now.
It’s about adjusting, not looking back. What if you had a 2 million linear bay?

(rant off, peace….)

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros

[Jeremy Garchow]

While I have nothing intelligent to add to this conversation, I have to remind myself that when I’m in your neck of the woods Bouke, I have to come get a cup of coffee from your $10,000 coffee maker! 🙂

[Michael Gissing]

Ben, your point is totally valid but I do think Bouke also has a point, however rudely he puts his points of view. I made the choice to embrace FCP six and a half years ago as it was rapidly becoming the dominant configuration in broadcast docos, which is my area. I watched facilities with expensive, old AVIDs disappear with frightening rapidity.

Now, having recently cycled my hardware, I have an eight month old MacPro with a Kona3, FCS3 and a Tangent wave, plugged into my old monitors. So the actual hardware changeover was around $10k US after six years. For me to change to CS5 and Da Vinci Resolve will cost around $4k including software and changing graphics cards. The rest of the room remains common. This cost can be conceivably be recovered from a single job. Most of my investment is in hardware and peripherals like HDCam and digi beta decks, broadcast monitors, speakers, furniture, cabling and patch bays. My coffee machine is hardly in Jeremy’s $10k category, but it is worth the same as a high end graphics card.

So when FCP made AVID facilities close their doors it was because they didn’t have the capacity to change due to the relatively enormous capital costs. But today, you can switch software, retaining most of your original hardware and recover that in less than a couple of months. So like, me, I would prefer not to change but if the industry decides that CS5 or AVID are better, then I have little disincentive to change camps for a relatively small outlay.

[Mark Raudonis]

Ben,

I’ve been in the equipment rental (hire) business for a long time. Started out with a 3/4″ linear tape system. Migrated to Avids. Switched to FCP. I’m sure I’ll be using something else further on down the line. My point is, equipment changes. That’s why people RENT now isn’t it!

This is neither a good thing or a bad thing… it’s just the way it is.

Part of the fun of this business is facing these choices and hopefully making the right business decision.

Good luck!

Mark

[Jason Porthouse]

Ben, it’s a piece of news that I can believe – anything is possible with the Beeb. Why they think CS5 is going to solve their problems I don’t know, but there’s two things apparent to me here. Apple have never really grasped the nettle when it came to wooing UK editors and producers over – as far as I can tell, this was left more to the resellers than the company themselves. And many editors schooled on Avid, fearful of the coming revolution that would enable anyone (or certainly production companies) to buy their own kit and cut just as good a program (small things like talent and experience excepted), refused to get their heads around FCP and badmouthed it to all and sundry.

The Beebs move to Premiere Pro makes sense from the point view that as budgets dwindle, the ‘preditor’ will be in the ascendent in organisations like that. fresh faced twentysomethings don’t cost much, and when you can stick em on a course to use an EX3 and plonk them in front of a ‘creative desktop’ why shell out on more? Or am I just too cynical?

I did some work on a flagship current affairs show recently and was surprised that they still outsourced post to an external house, especially as they had a couple of FCP suites in-house, unused. When I spoke to a producer about this, the sense I had was they never got beyond their editors’ griping about the switch from Avid to FCP – because they had ‘loads of problems with FCP losing sync all the time’ and it ‘wasn’t up to broadcast’ – all incorrect, I know, but classic problems you get when AVID mentality comes up against the different way of working FCP entails.

Sky’s decision to go with Avid makes sense in terms of sheer numbers of freelance editors out there – FCP is still lagging behind in this respect. Once the cost/benefit analysis is equal, thanks to Avid’s price -matching, then the sheer number of editors they can call upon, and hardware savings (not necessarily true, but perceived in the PC/Mac battle) would make it a natural choice.

So though FCP still remains my tool of choice, sometime soon I’m going to have to bite the bullet and delve back in to the world of Avid and Premiere. Don’t get me wrong, I learnt non-linear on Avids, so have no axe to grind, but it doesn’t feel like a move forward to me, as FCP suits the way I cut better.

Dunno how all this relates to your predicament – I guess the ideal, and for me too (though I don’t hire kit out I do have my own suite) would be software that is hardware agnostic, so FCP, PP and Avid all play nicely with whatever card (BM in my case) and we just swap boot drives as needed.

Of course, Apple could release FCP8 and blow everyone else into the weeds, though I won’t hold my breath.

Jason

_________________________________

Before you criticise a man, walk a mile in his shoes.
Then when you do criticise him, you’ll be a mile away. And have his shoes.

*the artist formally known as Jaymags*

[Walter Biscardi]

[Michael Gissing] “. So like, me, I would prefer not to change but if the industry decides that CS5 or AVID are better, then I have little disincentive to change camps for a relatively small outlay.”

Perfectly stated. We’re not tied to any one software package any longer. All the infrastructure in my facility will support FCP, Premiere or Avid with very little cash outlay. Premiere Pro is certainly gaining notice and Avid finally figured out to release the software only version.

Funny how the other guys can currently work with MXF and tapeless workflows better on a Mac than Apple can.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author, Chef.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media

“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” featuring Sigourney Weaver coming soon.

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[Andy Mees]

[walter biscardi] “All the infrastructure in my facility will support FCP, Premiere or Avid … “

Absolutely … Not exactly a recommended setup, but I have FCP 7, AVID MC5 and Adobe PP CS5 all installed on the same boot volume of my MBP, all running simultaneously (just for giggles) and as I switch back and forth between these active apps my MXO Mini MAX instantly switches to send the output from whichever is the frontmost app to my monitoring setup. Pointless to really run all three at the same time of course (my Mac doesn’t have enough RAM to handle all three apps efficiently) but its still cool to see everything working tickety-boo regardless of NLE.

[Neil Hurwitz]

An interesting discussion here BUT
There is a TECTONIC SHIFT about to happen in this
industry that you have all missed.
Quantel, The company that is always out in front from a
technology point of view, Think Paintbox,Think A62,
Think Harry & Henry, Think Dylan Disk Drives, has announced at
this years IBC the creation of QTUBE and demonstrated it live
and working. They also announced discussions about it with
a “MAJOR” US Software company. Now any of the major US softies
could buy Quantel for lunch and you get a very interesting
picture emerging. Not this year or next but certainly very soon.
Other companies have a habit of adopting and adapting
the Q’s stuff at a very reduced price point. So soon it won’t really
make a difference what seat your software is It will only have to
link to wherever the Media is stored

Neil Hurwitz