Mics for interviews, connected to camera – MKH 416, MKH50, Sanken CS-3e

[Bruce Watson]

[André Mascarenhas] “Should the mics I’m considering, like the MKH50, be ok connected directly to a camera?”

Probably yes. You’ll have to try it and see. But if your MKE600 is OK with it, the MKH50 should be also. The MKH50 has been a favorite hypercardioid of the Hollywood dialog set for quite a while, but there are (or were) quite a few on the used markets as people moved to the MKH8050 which is smaller and lighter which makes boom pole operators happy.

The reasons to use a field mixer include better mic preamps, better meters, flexibility in what your output is (you can feed balanced mic/line or unbalanced mic level to your camera), and better headphone monitoring. But the main reason I like my little MixPre-D is the limiters. They have saved me more than once and made me a believer in good limiters. I realize that you don’t want the extra piece of equipment, but good limiters are something to really think about. Just sayin’.

[André Mascarenhas]

[Bruce Watson] “there are (or were) quite a few on the used markets as people moved to the MKH8050 which is smaller and lighter which makes boom pole operators happy. “

Thanks, Bruce! Do you have any tips of websites to get used audio gear besides eBay? As you said, it seems hard to find used MKH50s.

[Bruce Watson] “The reasons to use a field mixer include better mic preamps, better meters, flexibility in what your output is (you can feed balanced mic/line or unbalanced mic level to your camera), and better headphone monitoring. But the main reason I like my little MixPre-D is the limiters. “

I’ve come through the name of MixPre-D a lot in many forums – seems like a great option, since is compact and affordable when compared to other SD options.
Still, I don’t know if I could take advantage of its potential. Do you know about any website, book, etc, where I can learn the basics of recording with a mixer? Pre amps, limiters, etc?

Thanks a lot!

[Bruce Watson]

[André Mascarenhas] “Thanks, Bruce! Do you have any tips of websites to get used audio gear besides eBay? As you said, it seems hard to find used MKH50s.”

You could try the video forums like DVXuser.com. Most of them seem to have a used equipment sub-forum. Things show up there on occasion, from mics to mixers to boompoles to c-stands. And of course cameras and lights.

You could look at the GearSlutz (hey, I didn’t name it) classifieds sub-forum. Lots of stuff there, but not much of it is aimed at dialog, it is mostly a studio music recording place. But I have seen MKH50’s come through there on occasion.

[André Mascarenhas] “Do you know about any website, book, etc, where I can learn the basics of recording with a mixer? Pre amps, limiters, etc?”

You can ask here. And most of the video forums have sound sub-forums. Since field mixers are usually used by video dialog recordists, you might want to search in those forums and see what people have been doing. You aren’t the first to ask, so investigate what others before you have asked and answered before you ask your own questions. Saves everyone some time that way.

[Craig Alan]

If you are doing one man band interviews and the subjects are fixed in terms of location I would get a SD 302 and mount it on a C stand arm close to your camera. It has a nice LED meter that will easily allow you to monitor the sound. It will be a solid investment and will accept up to three inputs.

This mike is a great interview Hypercardioid:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/642499-REG/Audio_Technica_AT4053B_AT4053b_Hypercardioid_Condenser_Microphone.html

Only $600 and really good quality and really stands up. With a Hollywood-stand, and an extra arm, a couple sand bags, and any boom pole and a Rycote shock mount you could float the mike really close to the subjects, set the level on your mixer with a little extra headroom and get really clean interviews. Not as good as a dedicated audio tech and boom pole operator but really decent. Sensitive mikes will pick up b.g. noise. But if you place the mike close and direct it away from unwanted sources you’ll be happy.
Yes you could do the same connected directly to your camera. But the 302 is a solid investment. The mix pre D is underpowered and not as good. I use both. But the only time I use the mix pre now is when we are using a DSLR camera that has no ability to provide phantom and xlr connections. That’s kind of its market.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.

[André Mascarenhas]

Thanks, Bruce! Indeed I’ve learned tons of things already in the past days when researching, just going through threads from here , DVXuser and other similar communities.

I couldn’t really find used MKH50s, I’ve decided to go with a new one. It’s actually a piece of mind.

Thanks again for your help in my response, and your many other comments in CC that I already came across when doing my researches!

[André Mascarenhas]

[Craig Alan] “I would get a SD 302 and mount it on a C stand arm close to your camera. It has a nice LED meter that will easily allow you to monitor the sound. It will be a solid investment and will accept up to three inputs. “

Thanks Craig! Some questions:
-would I connect the SD 302 to my C100? What about the 16-bit ?
– If I should go with an external recorder, what recorder would you recommend? Would a zoom/ tascam be enough, since it would be going through the SD?

As for the mic, I’m going for the MKH50, which seems to be a solid purchase that will last me for a long time, besides its beautiful nuances.

[Todd Terry]

I’m not an audio expert by any stretch (I’m a director and DP by profession), but I happened to be in this forum seeking advice about something else and saw this and thought I’d chime in just from a little personal experience…

I’ve used the MKH416 almost exclusively for several years now. The first time I used it I instantly fell in love, it has such a beautiful warm open sound. I use them for dialog in scenes, interviews, interiors, exteriors, everything.

I’ll take it one step further… a couple of years ago, when swapping some equipment out in the studio, some nimrod accidently dropped the AT mic that we used for voiceover work and it hit the stage floor pretty hard (ok, ok… it was me).

In a pinch I put one of the 416’s in the VO booth and I guess I shouldn’t be surprised but it sounded GREAT. I didn’t learn until later that a lot of the very top-end voice guys use the 416 as a booth mic. So, that’s what we use in there now, too.

So… while I can’t speak to any of the other mics you mentioned, I heartily endorse the MKH416. They are expensive, but worth every penny.

Now back to your regularly-scheduled experts who are a lot smarter about this stuff than me.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com

[Craig Alan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3R58ler6C1c

https://tyfordaudiovideo.blogspot.com/2012/03/non-shotgun-boom-mics-for-interiors-and.html

MKH50 is considered better than the AT4053b but its twice the price and the AT is really quite good for dialog and holds up well. Lots of use and small and light.

The Schoeps is really sweet ($1600). Its my favorite and most expensive mike i have used.

But I would say that mike placement, the talent, and the acoustics in the place you are shooting may be more important variables than the difference between these three mikes. All else being equal you get what you pay for.

Yes the 302 needs to be connected to the recorder be it the camcorder or a separate one. I haven’t used that Canon but Canon usually has pretty good audio compared to other brands at that price point.

If you get a zoom/ tascam make sure it has XLR inputs. I have no experience with these. SD makes really good mixer/recorders for a lot more money. You can get a 633 for $3,229.00 which would give you both a mixer and recorder for $1429 more than the mixer alone. Very good quality.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.

Some contents or functionalities here are not available due to your cookie preferences!

This happens because the functionality/content marked as “Google Youtube” uses cookies that you choosed to keep disabled. In order to view this content or use this functionality, please enable cookies: click here to open your cookie preferences.

[Ty Ford]

Hello Andre, and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

This may help: https://www.tyford.com/Ty_Ford_Audio_Bootcamp_Field_Guide.html

This may help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaUSXP-a3hA

The 416 is not the best for interiors because all shotgun mics with an interference tube are less directional at middle and low frequencies; hence roomy sound.

Here’s one of my posts from 5 years ago:

Mixers and the people who operate them are usually related to someone else on the project and are there solely to raise production costs, cause delays and bilk producers out of their money. (that’s a joke, ok?)

Mixers are more than knobs that let you vary the volume.

1. They let you vary volumes without shaking the camera or getting in the way of the camera op.
2. You may need to do that a lot with some people. I ride gain even if one person is talking if their voice fades on the end of each line. You can only do this in a relatively quiet environment, otherwise you bring up the ambient noise.
3. Mixer preamps (good ones) sound better than camera preamps.
4. Good mixers have input transformers that scrape off RF before it get into your audio.
5. Good mixers have limiters that allow you to record hotter, keeping your audio further above the noise floor without distorting.
6. Good mixers have EQ that lets you roll of LF HVAC noise before it gets into your audio.
7. Good mixers have mulitple outputs so you can feed more than one camera, or separate recorder simultaneously.
8. Good mixers make your sound better. If they didn’t pros wouldn’t use them.

I know you said your budget does not allow for a qualified audio person. Too bad. I shoot and run sound and there’s really no way one person can do those jobs really well at the same time. Your path should include reflection on how to raise your game and grow your work force so that you can improve your product.

Regards,

Ty Ford
Cow Audio Forum Leader

Want better production audio?: Ty Ford\’s Audio Bootcamp Field Guide
Ty Ford Blog: Ty Ford\’s Blog

Some contents or functionalities here are not available due to your cookie preferences!

This happens because the functionality/content marked as “Google Youtube” uses cookies that you choosed to keep disabled. In order to view this content or use this functionality, please enable cookies: click here to open your cookie preferences.

[Craig Alan]

Everything Ty says is spot on. I have learned more about audio from him than any other source. Quite frankly, read about audio and you are often overwhelmed by tech jargon that is often the kind that if you understand it, you wouldn’t need it in the first place. If you can afford one pro on an independent shoot, hire an audio tech with their own gear. Sound is the hardest craft on a basic level and ruins more shots and more productions when you don’t get it right.

That said, I am often a one man band. I have gotten decent sound on short form films where the talent is in a fixed location. You also need to train your talent in certain basics. No audio tech can correct for a talent that unpredictably raises/lowers their voice suddenly or turns their head away from the mike. And if you are shooting an interview where the talent stays in a fixed location and you are not doing a lot of camera movement: you can adjust your focus, angle, exposure levels; then calibrate your camera to your mixer (both devices are designed to do this); set your levels for each voice; then monitor the audio throughout the interview. Way easier as you gain experience. Better if you had an experienced audio tech to do it for you, but doable just the same. Floating a boom pole over a fixed location talent can work also and again not as well as having a skilled boom pole operator who aims at the talent’s mouth and monitors the sound to adjust to the voice characteristics of the speaker.

One tip you might try is to give the interviewer a series of unrelated questions and do a practice interview so you can learn the voice levels and characteristics of your talent. For some you might need to leave more headroom than others and determine how close you can get to the talent’s mouth. Room characteristics is a major variable as well.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.