Media Manager in FCP Studio 3…

[Charlie Key]

Hi there,

I read your post with some interest and I’m not exactly answering your question as I have not got my hands on 3 yet.
But we use media manager here to good effect because we are tapeless and it simply copies timelines for us and deletes all unused media with handles.. as I’m sure you do the same.
My question is, do you then export that MM timeline to tape? and thats where the problem arises? or is the problem simply speed altered footage when media managing initially? Because I have never had a problem with it!

All the best,

Charlie Key

Head of Post Production
Wedding TV ltd

[Mark Raudonis]

Michael,

There are plenty other reasons to upgrade besides just Media Manager. Has your specific issue been fixed?
If I were you, I’d spend the $299 and do your own testing. Regardless of what you may read here, what matters is how it works for you, with your specific workflow. Find out for yourself.

Mark

[Alan Okey]

[Michael Lansdell] “this is where the Media Manager causes problems, it can’t deal with footage that’s had it’s speed changed. “

What are some competing applications that can deal this scenario better than FCP? Would AVID be an improvement in this regard?

I have not had the luxury of working on AVID systems before. I hear constantly about how much better AVID’s media management is than FCP, but I’ve never had the opportunity to find out for myself what the differences are. Could someone post a few bullet points explaining why AVID’s media management is superior? I’m not doubting that it’s true, I’m just curious to know what the differences are.

[Michael Lansdell]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

Charlie – How I use the Media Manager depends upon the project. For shorter form programmes filmed entirely on DV-CAM I use Media Manager to create consolidated projects for the Online, by using the copy function. These projects rarely contain footage with speed changes applied and so I very rarely have a problem (although once with some sped up footage of some french kids going mad in a supermarket with a trolley it all came through at under 1% instead of 300% or so, a surprisingly nice effect but not what I wanted at all!). However, when we make longer archive programmes, I have footage coming in on DV-CAM, DVCPRO, DigiBeta, Beta SP, etc… In this case I prefer to capture the footage specifically for the onlie as some of those formats allow better colour depth than the footage used in the offline contains. In this case I use the Media Manager to create an “Offline” version of the project, and this is where I tend to have problems.

Mark – I wish it were up to me, but if I want to upgrade I need to present a reason too. For instance, we have six edit suites here, five offline and one online. All the offline suites are still running FCP Studio 1 because there hasn’t been a reason to upgrade them, but I’m running Studio 2 on the Online because we occasionally do Colour-grades/play-outs/etc for other people, and receiving a project we couldn’t open prompted it. So, I really need to know if it’s been fixed because we’ll need to buy six copies of it (Media Managing happens on the offline suites and I’ll have to be able to open it in the online) and I’d have to present what seems like a tangible reason to the powers that be.

Alan – I have no idea, sorry!

Does any of that make sense?

Cheers for your thoughts so far!

Michael Lansdell

Online Editor,
Available Light Productions Ltd

My system:

2 x 3 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
5GB DDR2 RAM
512MB ATI Radeon X1900 XT
OS X 10.4.11
Final Cut Pro 6.0.4
After Effects CS4
Blackmagic Design DeckLink HD Extreme (6.6.2)

Take a gander at my personal blog:

http://www.monstersareart.blogspot.com

[Shane Ross]

Speed changes in FCP have always had issues, especially with media manager. In FCP 6 and earlier, I would always scroll through the cut to see if there were any speed changes, then render those out as self contained clips, then reimport and replace the change, THEN media manage.

BUT…FCP 7 changed that. FCP 7 retains the speed change properly. Not making the 65% become 1045% or show a still frame. Everyone else in my shop is still FCP 6, but I have to media manage and then send to COLOR, and they are speed change freaks…so I upgraded to FCP 7 to do the media manage and color correct, then XML the cut back to FCP 6 to match everyone else. Works great.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[Mark Raudonis]

[Michael Lansdell] “All the offline suites are still running FCP Studio 1 because there hasn’t been a reason to upgrade them,”

Michael,

Penny wise, pound foolish. I can’t tell you (or your boss) how to run your business, but if it were me, I’d bring EVERYONE up to a more current level. Media Manager is just one of the reasons to upgrade. There are plenty of newer codecs and workflows that just aren’t a part of Studio 1.

Staying current (or close to it) is part of the cost of doing business.

Mark

[Michael Hancock]

[Alan Okey] “Could someone post a few bullet points explaining why AVID’s media management is superior?”

Here’s how Avid handles media compared to FCP:

In FCP, when you import something the software looks at where the file is and makes note of it. It leaves the file as is. Move the file, the media is offline. You’re in charge of organizing your media.

In Avid, when you capture or import something (picture, movie files, audio, etc…) Avid makes its own media (either OMF or MXF format) and stores it in a specific folder. Change the name of the folder structure (including capitalization, even) and the media is offline.

For example, if your media drive is M:\ and you import a Quicktime movie, Avid converts the Quicktime to Avid’s OMF or MXF format.

For OMF media, Avid uses this folder structure:
M:\OMFI MediaFiles\(media goes here)
It leaves the original Quicktime alone though, so you can move/delete, change them without affecting Avid’s links to the media (since it created it’s own media of the file).

If you’re using MXF it creates MXF media of the Quicktime and stores it here:
M:\Avid MediaFiles\MXF\1\(media goes here, and you can have up to 99 numbered folders)
Again, it leaves the original Quicktime alone so if you move it you don’t lose your links to media.

Because Avid does this, all of your media is always in the same place and managed by the NLE. It can’t, by default, be scattered across a lot of drives and buried in a lot of folders. Render files go in the same place as the media files.

All of this makes media management much, much easier. In addition, Avid creates database files of all your media and tracks them through that, and it’s pretty much rock solid.

When you “Media Manage” an Avid project you either Decompose your sequence (makes new offline master clips based on just the media you used, plus handles) so you can uprez, or you Consolidate, which creates new master clips and media based on just the media in the sequence (plus handles). Perfect for backing up. Both are pretty much foolproof. Why Avid handles media changes and whatnot better, I’m not entirely sure, but I assume it’s the way it tracks media (the databases) and all the metadata it assigns to clips.

So Avid’s media management is solid, but in exchange for that you lose the openess you have with FCP, Edius, Premiere, pretty much most other NLEs. If you have a ton of Quicktime movies to import you have to wait while Avid creates its own proprietary media of each Quicktime, so you take a hit up front. But once it’s OMF or MXF, you get a ton of realtime at full quality. So really you choose whether you want to take the hit up front in exchange for great media management and realtime capabilities, or you want instant access to your files but have less stable media management and more of a render at the end.

So it’s a tradeoff. I prefer the time hit up front from importing and I hate tracking media so I’m happy to let the NLE take care of it for me. When I have super tight deadlines, though, and a lot of Quicktimes, audio, logos, etc… to import I wish Avid was more open like FCP. Six one, half dozen of another.

Hope that made sense and answered your question Alan.

Michael

——————————-
I’ll be working late.

[Michael Lansdell]

If it was up to me we’d always run the very latest version of software, whether its FCP or OSX :o)

I just wanted to know if this issue is fixed so I can present a reason that is easy to grasp to those with the money. It will cost £1200+ to get all the systems up to date, which in TV terms isn’t vast sums, but would be considered unnecessary if it didn’t fix an issue we have with our work flow. As we are a fully contained production company (from pre-production through to delivery) we very rarely have issues with codecs and the like, so in many ways there isn’t that urgency for us to update if our current system is fine for the job at hand.

But as I said, I’d like to get us more up to date, I just need to present a case as it isn’t up to me – I’m just an employee! Shane Ross’ answer is encouraging, so I’ll try and get the go ahead on a couple of licenses to start off with as a test, before upgrading the lot.

Many thanks to you all!

Michael Lansdell

Online/Offline Editor

My system:

2 x 3 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
5GB DDR2 RAM
512MB ATI Radeon X1900 XT
OS X 10.4.11
Final Cut Pro 6.0.4
After Effects CS4
Blackmagic Design DeckLink HD Extreme (6.6.2)

Take a gander at my personal blog:

http://www.monstersareart.blogspot.com

[Michael Lansdell]

Huh, Intel only apparently. There go my upgrade dreams…

:o(

Michael Lansdell

Online/Offline Editor

My system:

2 x 3 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
5GB DDR2 RAM
512MB ATI Radeon X1900 XT
OS X 10.4.11
Final Cut Pro 6.0.4
After Effects CS4
Blackmagic Design DeckLink HD Extreme (6.6.2)

Take a gander at my personal blog:

http://www.monstersareart.blogspot.com

[Massimo Croce]

i agree with Michael Hancock