Letterboxing my work

[Walter Biscardi]

[Eoin Ryan] “I like this look. However, I’m reading and hearing that when some people view this on their TV there will be black bars at the sides of the TVs as well as at the bottom of the screen.
“

On an HDTV, yes this will happen if the DVD Player is set up to play in standard mode OR they are playing the DVD in a BluRay player.

It’s like when you’re watching an HD tv channel and a Standard Def Letterbox commercial shows up. It’s letterboxed top to bottom AND pillarboxed left to right.

There’s nothing you can do about this since you’re shooting SD except to shoot in Anamorphic and then the DVD player should fill the screen with the image. But this all depends on how the end user has their TV, their DVD/BluRay player setup.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Biscardi Creative Media
HD and SD Production for Broadcast and Independent Productions.

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[Eoin Ryan]

“There’s nothing you can do about this since you’re shooting SD except to shoot in Anamorphic and then the DVD player should fill the screen with the image. But this all depends on how the end user has their TV, their DVD/BluRay player setup. ”

I’m already shooting in anamorphic. However, I’m editing the footage as letterbox. And then exporting the footage as letterbox. Come to think of it, when I did bring the DVD samples to electronics stores to try them out on various TVs and players, it was only when I played it on a BluRay player that I got the pillarboxing aswell.

So do you mean I can continue to do what I’m doing and not worry about someone being stuck with pillarboxing? I mean, if it depends on their TV settings for example, then they should/will be able to change that to a different setting, say “16:9” and my image will appear as I want it to: black bars top and bottom even on a widescreen TV?

[Walter Biscardi]

[Eoin Ryan] “I’m already shooting in anamorphic. However, I’m editing the footage as letterbox. And then exporting the footage as letterbox. “

Why? Export as Anamorphic. The DVD will play as full screen in a 16:9 TV and Letterboxed on a 4:3.

If you’re letterboxing it before it gets to the DVD, it will play with letterboxing no matter what kind of TV it plays back on.

Kind of defeats the purpose of shooting anamorphic to begin with.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Biscardi Creative Media
HD and SD Production for Broadcast and Independent Productions.

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[Eoin Ryan]

“Why? Export as Anamorphic. The DVD will play as full screen in a 16:9 TV and Letterboxed on a 4:3.”

The way I do it, even though letterboxed on a 16:9 TV, I still think the image looks better with the black bars at the top and bottom (once there’s none at the sides). By letterboxing myself, I’m preserving the original 16:9 aspect ratio but making sure there’s black bars on the image when displayed on any TV.

“If you’re letterboxing it before it gets to the DVD, it will play with letterboxing no matter what kind of TV it plays back on.”

Did you mean to say “pillarboxing no matter what kind of…”. My intention is to have the footage letterboxed as I think it looks better (and it still is widescreen – the full widescreen frame is showing). Once the black bars are there, I think it adds a cinematic feel to it. However, pillarboxing is not something I want/like.

“Kind of defeats the purpose of shooting anamorphic to begin with.”

I don’t understand this. Can you explain?

Thanks for the help.

[Walter Biscardi]

[Eoin Ryan] “Did you mean to say “pillarboxing no matter what kind of…”. My intention is to have the footage letterboxed as I think it looks better (and it still is widescreen – the full widescreen frame is showing). Once the black bars are there, I think it adds a cinematic feel to it. However, pillarboxing is not something I want/like. “

No, I meant Letterboxing. When you watch the DVD on a 16:9 widescreen TV, does it fill the screen or is it still letterboxed?

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Biscardi Creative Media
HD and SD Production for Broadcast and Independent Productions.

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[Eoin Ryan]

When I watch the DVD on a 42″ plasma TV, the black bars are at the top and bottom of the screen (so yes, it’s letterboxed).

There are no black bars at the sides. However, just because there are no black bars at the sides on this TV (or a few others), doesn’t mean it won’t happen on someones elses TV.

It looks better, in my opinion, than if it was exported as anamporphic and played on this TV. I tried this, and it fills the entire screen as you say, but it lacks that “cinematic” feel that the black bars bring.

I’m certainly not losing any image. It’s all there. But what you do in this situation? I’m afraid that the ordinary people who I give the DVDs to won’t have their TV/DVD sets set up properly (nor know how to do it), and will be watching their weddings with black bars at top, bottom AND sides. Top and bottom is fine with me.

Thanks again.

[Walter Biscardi]

[Eoin Ryan] “When I watch the DVD on a 42” plasma TV, the black bars are at the top and bottom of the screen (so yes, it’s letterboxed). “

Then the video is being stretched horizontally and this is completely defeating the purpose of shooting Anamorphic. What you’re watching is a 4:3 letterboxed picture being stretched horizontally instead of watching a true 16:9 image being scaled up to fill the screen. The latter will look better.

We have 4 HD displays here and we test regular DVD’s on them all the time. An anamorphic file will play properly, full screen on a 16:9 TV and 4:3 letterboxed automatically off a DVD. What you’re doing is stretching a 4:3 image.

[Eoin Ryan] “There are no black bars at the sides. However, just because there are no black bars at the sides on this TV (or a few others), doesn’t mean it won’t happen on someones elses TV. “

This will always happen with an SD video on an HD player, like a BluRay player, at least with the current models. The current models so far do not give you the option to stretch out an SD video in HD mode. This is not the TV, this is playing an SD DVD back in a BluRay player.

[Eoin Ryan] “Top and bottom is fine with me. “

I really don’t think the brides especially are going to appreciate being stretched out horizontally. I could be wrong. Make an Anamorphic DVD and you’ll see it in proper 16:9 ratio on the widescreen TV.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Biscardi Creative Media
HD and SD Production for Broadcast and Independent Productions.

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[Eoin Ryan]

Thank you Walter. You’ve been very helpful.

[Todd Reid]

I hear and respect your argument FOR the black bars on top/bottom to achieve a cinematic feel, however…
I would try to steer you away from this thinking. Here’s why.

When most people watched tv and videos on 4×3 tvs, this was true. Most movies, or higher end productions needed to be shown in letterbox in order to show everything that was shot, especially the far left and right of the screen. There have been thousands of editors to act and feel the exact way you have described. I myself have “added value” to many a project merely by slapping black bars on it.
Now that more and more people are replacing those older (soon to be ancient) tvs with newer 16×9 viewing portals, I think that the bars are actually a detriment. I would much rather see nice looking video or graphics in that real estate than black bars. I have had many clients request to “remove those thick black lines, cause they feel they are missing something” (ironic I know, since that whole concept is designed to show everything). When anamorphic is used correctly, you will still get the cinematic feel on older 4×3 tvs, but when the same video is viewed on newer tv, it will fill the screen and give your client the appearance they are “getting more”. Another way to think about it is that it ALREADY HAS the cinematic feel you are trying to achieve. Its in the same aspect ratio of a movie, no need to decrease the amount of real estate.

Now having said that, may I suggest that you follow Walter’s advice and “fill the screen” anamorphic-ly, but choose a few shots or scenes and letterbox them. This will keep your cinematic feel, but not look as if you slapped black bars on it. Another technique I have used it to create colored letterbox, white looked very nice, however ANY color letterbox used throughout a video is imho overkill.

When it comes down to brass tax, do whatever your CLIENTS like, not what you like. After all, they are the ones paying for it.
If they request letterboxing, by all means, letterbox.
If they have invested thousands of dollars on a state of the art media room, and are accustomed to seeing all movies fill the entire screen, then seeing your black bars may be a disappointment to them.

I hope this all makes sense to you, and it is just one man’s opinion.

[Eoin Ryan]

Thanks for the comments.

Let me tell you what my main concern is.

I’ve been letterboxing my wedding DVDs for years and have had nothing but great feedback. They are standard def DVDs. I haven’t moved to HD yet. I shoot in 16:9 and edit in Final Cut Pro (see pic called ‘letterboxed’ below – in other post) and export as letterboxed. I author my DVDs on iDVD (professional encode).

When I drop the file into iDVD, (see pics 1, 2, 3), I get letterbox, which is what I want.

However, lately I have been thinking, because of all the new TVs and DVD players out there, that it cold be looking really different depending on other peoples sets etc. So I went and tested the DVDs. They are fine on most set ups. However, on a Blu-Ray player it was pillarboxed (horrible) and for some reason the image looked really bad (sort of like pixelated). Can someone explain this to me about why the image looked really bad?

So I like the look of the black bars at the top and bottom, but my concern is that people have newer players/TVs now and I want my work to look the best it can.

So based on advice above I’ve edited a clip in anamorphic (no black bars) and dropped it in iDVD, with the intention of playing it on my 16:9 plasma screen. When I did this, the video image filled the whole screen alright, but looked a bit distorted. I don’t think iDVD handled the clip correctly when I dropped it into it. See pic called ‘anamorphic test in iDVD’ – in other post) to let me know.

Thanks for the help guys.