lens consideration for HDX900

[Nick Gardner]

Hi,

I have had the same thoughts for some time now. When using film lenses, some are better than others even of the same type from the same company, so I reasoned that some 2/3″ lenses are better than others. I mentioned this to the owner of my local rental house and he agreed that when projected some of his SD lenses looked better than the HD lenses. I recently did a test between a fuji HD zoom, a fuji SD zoom (a couple of years old, internal focus etc), and a fuji zoom I bought on ebay for $80 for the purposes of this test. None of these lenes have doublers by the way, I always order my lenes without them.

I shot a resolution chart at the same stop (2.8) on all three lenses. Then I took the tape upstairs and cut them together back to back and watched them on a Sony 36″ HD CRT, next to a JVC 17″ HD CRT as well.

Hands down the sharpest lens was the external focus $80 20 year old ebay lens – seriously. Of course, that lens breathes like crazy, the color temp was a little (only a very little) bluer than the others, and it didn’t handle flares as well as the newer lenses.

The other two lenes performed almost identically with the HD zoom being a tiny bit sharper, and the SD lens showing LESS chromatic deviations.

I should also note that I use a Cannon 2.8 300mm with excelent results, and Century sells this lens for HD use. I also know people who use a nikon adapter with long lenes on thier varicams. I did a National Geographic show where myself and another camerman both shot a bunch of long lens stuff. He used long Nikons, I used my Cannon 300. When I saw the shots cut together in the show I could not tell the difference.

I don’t see any reason not to use whatever lens has a look that you like. What you see is what you get and if you don’t like the look of a certain lens, dont use it.

Now I’m sure that all of the techno heads are going to flame me and tell me all about how the chips are at diferent focal planes and that they even moved the red chip spec for HD etc, etc, etc. Yeah I know all that. I also know that 1/10000 of an inch is a BS tolerance in the real world. Yes, in laboritory conditions with everything set up to spec, these tolerances yield the most perfect pictures. If it’s a hot day or the lens mount is not surgically clean, then it’s just pretty damn close.

And anyway, all that goes out the window when you throw up a 1/4 promist. Use lenses that look good. I’m hanging on to the ebay lens.

Just my 2 cents,

Nick Gardner
Local 600
DP

[Sean Fine]

When you are acting in front of the camera do you prefer HD or SD glass?

[Leo Ticheli]

Hi Nick,

Your experience exactly matches mine. Let’s remember that the first “HD” lenses were nothing more than SD lenses that tested at the top of their model and were slapped with an “HD” label.

I like to think about cinematographers who carefully select the most perfect lenses and then put a silk stocking in front of the glass! Crazy. Of course starting with the best glass is important, but, truthfully, on television it’s hard to distinguish one lens from another. Without a side by side, it may well be impossible.

I have my very own “secret” lens, and I’m not telling what it is, but it helps me make very pretty pictures.

Good shooting!

Leo

[Scott Plante]

Currently I have a SD FUJI 15×8 that I’m quite happy with, but that “HD” label is almost a pre-requesite for some producers. I’m thinking about buying the sticker.

Seriously, the difference between the SD 15×8 and the new HD 17×7.6 is hard to see. I’m not sure if dumping a whack of money for a sticker is worth it. And if that’s not enough, the outside diameter of most of the new lenses ranges from 85-107mm. At least the 17×6 is close (85mm) to the old 82mm standard that you can keep using the same matte box and filters (with a change to the insert)instead of having to replace all of it.

I fully understand the whole MTF argument and the slight colour shifting, but is it worth $13-$20 K? I’m wondering what the combination of the old SD lens with a HD wide angle attachment would do?

Ah more testing.

Visualeyes

[Tony]

Best recommendation is to visit a real camera lab where can see the major differences in lens shading issues between SD and high end HD lenses.

You really do pay for what you get.

However in the world of ENG, reality tv work which is what honestly alot of the lower cost HD camcorders are aimed for then well who give a
f#$% about image quality? If the crap on tv had to match high end image quality of spots then reality tv would be shot on film or HDCAM SR but that is not going to happen ever.

Producers in that world are accustomed to paying cheap for crew, equipment etc so it may not make a high end lens a great return for ROI.

The real issue here is what is considered “good enough” for your application will surely not be acceptable for another end user.

So only you and your client base can decide what works for you.

Tony Salgado