Is FCPX really worth it?

[Neil Goodman]

i think not, the only innovation they made to me which is obvious is the keywording, which i think is a better way to subclip, essentially its the same thing but then they contradict themselves by not being able to save your in and outs if you go to a different window.

Everyone will say, but what about the background rendering ? well imo its lame because you still have to wait for it to finish and in fact its not doing anything in thr background at all.

A far as the magnetic timeline, i feel its counter intuitive to the whole scope of editing. Its really just a mess and i cn edit in it, i just dont want to.

It seems like every cool thing they introduced is married to some lame way of deterring you to use it. Fr example the scopes. There awesome, full color, real time, but why cant i open them in a new window, why do i have to make a choice wether to either have my record monitor so small in order to share the space that color corrections are barely visible or have the scopes so small i cant even see the fine points?

We all asked for impovements but they ignored so much and decided to do there own thing anyways, which i think is gonna continue to the future. They dont care.

Avid and Adobe are and have been listening to see what WE really want, and albeit slowly, there are responding and you cant ignore the strides these companies have made to build upon thee NLE legacy, not completely change it.

The thing that irks me the most is that everyone is making excuses, saying they had to change it to accommodate the new 64 bit architecture. Well i call bullshit. The Logic team was able to implement w/o changing a damn thing. In fact you wouldnt notice it unless you read the readme with the fix’s and changes. I think they could of kept everything exactly the same and just made it 64 bit, added background (even tho its not background) etc etc wtihout doing anything to the look and feel of the program. We all know that this was possible. They chose to ignore us.

Neil Goodman: Editor of New Media Production – NBC/Universal

[Shane Ross]

Is the DRAMA worth it? Or the editing application? Or…is the editing application worth all the drama associated with it?

Well..not quite sure how to answer this. Apple had an editing application that reached a broad spectrum of users. From hobbyists to independent filmmakers to very high end post work for broadcast TV and feature film. It covered the gamut. But then when FCX came out, it pretty much decapitated itself…cutting itself off from the high end market that got FCP the market share it enjoys today. People bought FCP because it was used on COLD MOUNTAIN and ZODIAK. Because Bunim/Murray had 100+ seats on all the reality shows it worked on. Because it was used in Scrubs…because it was the first to really work with RED. People wanted the NLE that professionals used, on professional projects.

And, in fact, FCP was poised to DOMINATE the high end post market. Avid was struggling to stay alive, even though it had a wide user base in features and TV. It was losing ground, and shedding people, and losing money. FCP was ready to take over.

Then FCX came out and cut itself loose from that market. It was like a fantastic gift to Avid…”here, have your users back. We don’t want them anymore.” And it left a HUGE hole to be filled that Avid couldn’t fill. A potential hole, that is. When FCP 7 stops being useful, people need a replacement…and Adobe has a toolset very similar to FCS…and will fill that remaining gap.

But the drama of the release….is it worth it? Yes. Because of this the OTHER NLE makers will work harder to please the end user. Avid working hard and listening to people’s needs. Adobe also reaching out and really listening to what people want, and striving to meet their needs. We haven’t seen this much “listening” in a long long time. Not since Avid first started out. Now these companies know how much they need to actually cater to our needs. That WE are in charge, because we have several NLEs to choose from. So if they want our business, they’d better give us what we need, or we will use the other guy.

It shows how much power us editors have…how much we can affect the NLE market. And that is a GOOD thing. Now it isn’t limited to those of us with the bigger voices, but open to everyone.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[Tom Wolsky]

If a market has reached or is nearing saturation, it becomes necessary to change the market. FCP probably exceeded the number of “professional” editors in the world. It was clear there was really no room for growth.

Apple is a mobile device company, laptops, tablets, phones. It’s hardware and software is designed primarily for that market space. A common application base that supports media from mobile devices on tablets and laptops and on to larger hardware was needed. This is were Apple decided it had to go. If these devices or similar devices are going to be used for content creation by professionals then Apple hardware and software will support them; if not, then it won’t. The market space that uses portable devices from phones on up is the market space Apple has chosen to support. Steve Jobs said it a number of years ago. This is what they are and where they’re going. If you’re not going down that road Apple can only offer you limited support. They are not a computer company. They stopped being a computer company years ago. Their interest in software for computers is pretty limited.

When looked at it from this point of view their decision process is pretty inevitable, however poorly the execution of that process was delivered.

All the best,

Tom

Class on Demand DVDs “Complete Training for FCP7,” “Basic Training for FCS” and “Final Cut Express Made Easy”
Coming in 2011 “Complete Training for FCPX” from Class on Demand
“Final Cut Pro X for iMovie and Final Cut Express Users” from Focal Press

[Garrett Evans]

I agree with Tom…Apple is following the dollars.

Now, that’s not to say the professional community might have been deserving of a better roll out, explaination, or just straight talk from Apple…

MacPro OSX 10.6.8 2×2.26 QCIX 10GB 1066MHz DDR3 FCP7.0.3/FCS3
FCSvr1.5 Xsan2.2 DotHill 24TB QlogicSANbox 8GB ATTO 8GB

[Les Kaye]

[Tom Wolsky] “Their interest in software for computers is pretty limited.”

Astute comment Tom. Still, there’s a (very small) part of me that thinks perhaps Tim Cook won’t be as rigid about these decisions as Steve Jobs, and that perhaps he might make things right.

I’m of mixed feeling about the rollout: I can understand the change in architecture, and I can even understand a change in UI. Let’s face it, the editing workflow is basically one that goes back 40 years. It’s the wholesale dropping of features and dismissal of FCP’s core customer base that’s head-scratching. It’s never really a good idea to tell your users that you’re dropping features. Something Netflix has also just discovered.

IMHO, since FCP is basically a rounding error to Apple these days, what would be the best thing at this point for its users would be for Apple to simply sell the Pro-App division. Which I also know will never happen.

So yes, while there needed to be a change. it was a debacle on all levels: technical, PR, etc. Apple did NOT come out smelling like a rose.

http://www.leskaye.net

[David Roth weiss]

[Garrett Evans] “I agree with Tom…Apple is following the dollars.”

That’s a given, Apple is a business after all.

[Garrett Evans] “Now, that’s not to say the professional community might have been deserving of a better roll out, explaination, or just straight talk from Apple…”

This more in line with my question, which is really asking if what FCP X offers is really in line with the drama Apple has chosen to create around it?

The world is in a tumultuous state of upheaval, and this industry was in a state of upheaval before FCPX was released; the question comes down to, does FCPX really deliver enough to justify all the drama? Would Apple have done better to choose an entirely different approach that would not have generated as much turmoil and civil unrest/dispute?

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
https://www.drwfilms.com

Don’t miss my new Creative Cow Podcast: Bringing “The Whale” to the Big Screen:
https://library.creativecow.net/weiss_roth_david/Podcast-Series-2-MikeParfitandSuzanneChisholm/1

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums.

[Garrett Evans]

Well, if we’re going back in time, to do it all over again…I (Apple) would never had thrown the kind of weight they did at NAB, hijacking a stage and holding our community hostage for a few days or weeks, only to essentially pee down our necks and tell us it’s just rain.

That’s a little strong I admit. But jeeze…at the time there wasn’t much debate about FCP7 riding the top of the heap, so perhaps a bit of professional restraint and tact we’re in order.

So, to answer in my opinion…no, the drama was definity not needed or worth it. We’re pros, for crying out loud…tell us straight the way it is, thank us for our loyalty, and leave us with choices.

MacPro OSX 10.6.8 2×2.26 QCIX 10GB 1066MHz DDR3 FCP7.0.3/FCS3
FCSvr1.5 Xsan2.2 DotHill 24TB QlogicSANbox 8GB ATTO 8GB

[Clint Wardlow]

On a personal level, it was worth it in someways because it put the Adobe Production Suite in my price range. Admittedly I am not “professional” on the same level as some on this forum. I consider myself an experimental filmmaker. I don’t really make a lot of money on my projects.

I’ve lusted after the CS5 production suite since it was announced, if only to get my hands on Photoshop Extended and AfterEffects. But the $1,600 price tag was daunting at best. I snapped it up at $850.

On the downside, the EOL of Color was a blow. I was hoping for many years of upgrades. I tried free DaVinchi Lite–and frankly it just doesn’t get the job done with its myriad of restrictions. To purchase DaVinchi Resolve and the associated hardware to make it work at its best, I would have to hemorrhage cash.

Was it worth it? Strictly on a personal level, I would say yes and no. Yes ’cause of the temporary price drop in Adobe….no because of the EOL of affordable color grading.

No matter how the FCPX thingy plays out in the future, the shake up it stirred did open up some purchasing opportunities that were priced out of range for a filmmaker on a budget like myself.

[John Christie]

David

Apple could have saved themselves a lot of grief by calling the program what it really is: iMovie Pro. This would have given them the opportunity to test the waters before hand and get us all used to the ideas being presented. Instead, Apple decided to create all the drama by EOLing FCP 7 and Colour. Is the drama worth it? Well it’s been great fun to watch and read about. Apple decided to choose a new path that doesn’t meet my companies needs, therefore I will have to change editing applications.

Cheers

John C

[Tom Wolsky]

I think the disruption and unrest was/is in such a marginal community of users in relation to the whole community of Apple product users that Apple, however much they may care, simply preferred to shrug and accept the damage. The pro apps developers were clearly aware that the the reaction was going to be very negative; they perhaps underestimated the users ability to energize that unrest and sustain it. So, was it worth it for Apple? I believe in the long term, yes it was. It was a necessary evil. Given there was going to be a serious push back against the product, was the release well handled? Absolutely not at all. It was mismanaged from NAB on, and further compounded with the actual release. The primary mismanagement was the refusal or reluctance to address what they knew was coming. Ignoring it, pretending nothing was going to happen, all was going to be rosy was just silly, and a case of marketing hopes and dreams overruling common sense and competent management.

All the best,

Tom

Class on Demand DVDs “Complete Training for FCP7,” “Basic Training for FCS” and “Final Cut Express Made Easy”
Coming in 2011 “Complete Training for FCPX” from Class on Demand
“Final Cut Pro X for iMovie and Final Cut Express Users” from Focal Press