in need of some serious advice

[Nick Griffin]

Rob-

Sorry to say this, but I think you’re hosed. And it’s both your fault and the fault the people who hired you. They didn’t properly set things up for you and you let them. At some point you should have asked (demanded?) at least a couple of hours for you to go through the assets, their condition and their locations BEFORE they split town.

Now you’re left to either point out that their stuff was not as organized as they thought it was or that they made a serious error in expecting an outsider to read their minds with no input. OR… they’re grinding you, knowing that to get their project done in the timeframe given you’ll need to devote 20+ hour days to sifting through their stuff to find what’s there and what’s not.

I may be wrong, but I don’t see how this ends well. Sorry, and I do hope I’m wrong.

BTW- liked the pretzel video. For the kind of show it is it’s clean, logical and holds together well. Not a glamorous piece but then again a whole lot of the work out there isn’t either.

[David Roth weiss]

As a matter of fact, I have been in a similar position and I would advise you that the only good way to deal with a situation like this is to pull the plug ASAP.

No matter how tempting it might be to try to pull something off and try to be a hero, you are better off to hold up post until the client returns to civilization. They might be slightly upset that the progress they’d hoped for hasn’t happened, but at least they will realize that you made an honest call to get off the clock as soon as you realized their problem.

Hopefully, they will realize that they didn’t give you the goods you needed to do the job properly, and they’ll be grateful that you decided to shut down until they could be consulted.

I think you will find that if you follow this advice your chance of preserving the job for yourself is good, and maybe you’ll find that their missing project files are organized and helpful. If not, at least you’ll know where you stand and you won’t be concerned that anything you did created the mess.

Hope this helps,
David

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.

[Craig Seeman]

There are a couple of rules you should come out this with as far as business lessons are concerned. The other posts do allude to them.

Never assume the client’s description of the job is accurate.

Never agree to a time frame until you’ve seen the materials.

You should always ask to see the materials with the client present and discuss project organization. Once the client comes back and you can sit down with them you might find the first task would be to organize their material. If it’s as big and bad as you describe I wouldn’t commit to a time frame. You can tell how you think it should be organized if they don’t have a plan themselves. They may appreciate your input.

The next phase might be to start on the specific projects. At that point everything is organized the way and they want and at this point you might be able to give an estimate for a specific project.

When you do meet with them give a “scope” of what you saw. Explain the organizational issues and how how you might improve things for long term efficiency and how that will save them both time and money in the long term. With the right conversation they’ll appreciate that you’ve actually done some even if it’s a basic scope and analysis. You’re offering a solution to their problems and clients appreciate that. Tell them you stopped after the scope because you want them in on the decision process because this will be a long term and beneficial improvement for them. Played right, if they’re night grinders, you could be a real hero. You’re showing off both project managerial skills and deference to their input.

P.S. Make sure there are no shotguns in the room when you talk to them. Let them know that sometimes you have clean up the buckshot pellets before you cook the meal.

[Rob Grauert]

Thanks for the advice fellas. In the future I will make it a point to confirm I have all the media I need. As a youngster in this industry, I guess some things I just have to learn the hard way.

Unfortunately though, David, even though I’d like to, I can’t pull the plug. This isn’t a freelance gig. I’ve been hired to work in the multimedia department of a company that makes shotguns. If I stop working on this project, I will be coming to work everyday with nothing to do until my supervisors return from their shoot – practically stealing the company’s money since I have a salary. And besides, I know the footage exists because I’ve seen it from earlier versions of their DVD catalog. It’s just a matter of looking for it, which isn’t fun under a tight deadline.

And I’m glad you enjoyed the pretzel video, Nick. Made that in college in an attempt to emulate How It’s Made. Movin onto bigger and better things now though, haha.

Thanks again guys.

Robert J. Grauert, Jr.
http://www.robgrauert.com

[Craig Seeman]

Rob, you should probably focus on organizing all the material. See my post but ignore stopping to wait for them. Obviously you can’t finish the project until all the material is organize. One missed deadline will result in much more efficient work in the future. If you’re forthright with them, they may well appreciate that you’re really thinking long term for them.

[David Roth weiss]

[Rob Grauert] “‘ve been hired to work in the multimedia department of a company that makes shotguns.”

I understand that the temptation to go postal is probably strong, but as long as they don’t store ammo nearby you’ll be all right.

This is excellent experience for you — conjuring up things out of thin air is always something that your clients will appreciate and they do pay a bit more for magic.

Meanwhile, why not show them what organization looks like? Perhaps they don’t know it when they see it?

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.

[David Roth weiss]

Excellent advice Craig.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.

[Shane Ross]

EXCELLENT advice Craig.

I have been dumped into this situation more than a few times, and is the whole reason I made my GETTING ORGANIZED DVD. Because when I work on multiple editor shows, they are organized in such a way that we all know how to look for things…there is a uniformity to the organization. But when I land in projects or at companies that aren’t used to this…have one guy who has ALWAYS done things this way, I find that I have NO CLUE how they did things. And finding stuff is a task and a half. I made this DVD in hopes that many people will use it, so when I landed at a company they MIGHT have used it and I could then find things.

I am always amazed at how people organize things. Or rather, DON’T organize things. And when I take a job at a company, I always ask for a day or two to familiarize myself with the footage and organization, or use the time to organize the footage…thus learning what I have.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[Rob Grauert]

Yup, I purchased that DVD not too long ago when it was on sale. Most of the tips I have already been doing, but I definitely learned a few more great tips. I’m hoping after this project they will let me devote a lot of time to implementing that same system of organization as well as set up a data base with File Maker Pro.

As for the comments about stopping and starting to organize now: I completely agree and I’d love to do that, but I just can’t. It probably will take months to organize the terabytes of footage. And these videos have to get done for the new year. They’ve done it in the past, so it can be done. It’s just a matter of finding what I need, which I spend more time doing than actually editing. But what’s the point of a DVD catalog that is months late?

I certainly value and appreciate all the advice though. Thank you.

Robert J. Grauert, Jr.
http://www.robgrauert.com

[Craig Seeman]

[Rob Grauert]
“I feel there is very little footage to even work with
…
I checked other drives around the facility but came up with nothing. It’s like they’re playing a joke on us.
…
I’m am on the verge of being fired for not being able to get this done, however, I don’t feel there is anything I can do about it. “

The above is from your original post. Either you can or can’t get it done. The above indicated you can’t.

[Rob Grauert]
“They’ve done it in the past, so it can be done.”

. . . maybe by the person who had done it previously. You have no idea what those circumstances were. Maybe they already knew where the source files were. Maybe they had more time.

You buy a new car and it drives well. It gets into a major collision and it no longer drives like new. You have no idea when the wreck occurred in this case.

If you can do this why did you ask for our advice?

If you don’t address this situation and do fail they you certainly can be fired. The first the manager will tell you before letting you go is, “If you had a problem you should have spoken to us about it.”