Hypothetical

[Brett Sherman]

While I love the keyword tagging of FCP X, I find I don’t use it all that much because of the time it takes. When I need it, it’s there.

For me, I’ve come to love the trackless editing. Having edited with FCP X for over a year now, I just find it more logical and efficient. I find there are a lot more options for choosing how to lock things together. I find music editing much easier. And having audio with the video makes a lot of sense for me. It’s easier to find the audio track, since the picture of what makes the sound is right next to it. It’s also more efficient with screen space. In FCP 7 I used to devote an entire monitor to the timeline so I could see all the tracks without scrolling up and down.

So my answer is no, I’m not interested in going back to tracks.

[David Mathis]

Interesting that you bring this up. Part of me does like the timeline but the other part does not. Tracks are better, just my opinion.

Now that I am off that tangent, any editing software would greatly benefit from how Final Cut Pro does organize clips. The last major update was a huge improvement. Avid is a bit clunky when it comes to importing clips into a project. I have not used the latest and greatest version of Premiere Pro since it is subscription only. I will say it is easier to import clips in there.

One thing that Apple should bring back is storyboard editing. With the previous version, one could arrange clips in a certain order, drag them over to the canvas and easily make a rough cut within a few seconds. Premiere does the same thing but it is called something else. Not sure about Avid having this feature.

On another subject, but one that is related: Adobe should look at adding a group like feature much like Motion has. I know that pre-comps are often necessary but having to switch between comps to make a change then back over is not exactly efficient. Easy to do but efficient it is not. Motion could likewise benefit from having the ability to parent layers, have a null object and expressions. Then again, editors are the target audience.

[Ricardo Marty]

Where in Premiere cs 6 is the Storyboard editing? I use to have a NLE that had a very capable storyboard interface that was great for building and manpilating a timeline, specialy for event projects.

Pinnacle pro 17 previously avid studio(now Corel) has tracks,magnetic timline and a very smnilar library interface it also has a storyboard but not quite to my liking. Its quite capable and getting better.

I have avid 6 but i cant get into it it just seems to clunky for me though I know its probably not.

I am looking into fcpx (never will be an adobe slave, yes gary i read your posts) If it fixes its motion link i will be in. If it gets the storyboard interface i will definitly jump in.

Ricardo Marty

[Scott Witthaus]

What’s this all about? Does this have anything to do with the ACA? 😉

I think Media Composer needs to fix what it already has on it’s plate before adopting FCPX-like features.

I also think the user-base of MC would howl bloody murder with a “radical” change like that. Remember the Smart Tool? I was a beta-tester on that one, and you would have thought the sky had fallen.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter

[David Mathis]

Adobe call is it “Automate To Sequence”, same principal just a different name.

Here is a link: https://tv.adobe.com/watch/adobe-beginner-classes-with-dennis-radeke/episode-43-premiere-pro-basics-series-automate-to-sequence-and-applying-multiple-effects/

[David Mathis]

[Scott Witthaus] “I also think the user-base of MC would howl bloody murder with a “radical” change like that. Remember the Smart Tool? I was a beta-tester on that one, and you would have thought the sky had fallen.”

Resistance is futile! Evil laugh included at no extra cost! 🙂

[Franz Bieberkopf]

Oliver,

As a refugee from the Avid of yore (though hypocritically still using Pro Tools), it would take a lot more than a few interface changes to draw me back.

In terms of FCP X, the keywording and skimming aren’t enough to overcome shortcomings like the timeline, limited audio mixing, and platform lock-in. That said, there are things that FCP X does nicely that other NLEs can learn from.

In other words, I don’t think the features you’ve focused on solve any problems or address issues I have with NLEs. Native formats in FCP7 sounds more attractive as a hypothetical.

Franz.

[Bret Williams]

Avid, it’s just too clunky to me. And I don’t think I want tracks back. Once you bring back tracks, you bring back all the BS that comes with it. Patching, locking, and destructive editing. I could take or leave the horizontal magnetism (can we just call it full-time ripple mode already?) But I like connections and I LOVE vertical magnetism/tracklessness. For compositing, you just move things around vertically and things get out of the way. For editing I can edit to the timeline with abandon and not have to be so precise with patching or worry if I’m going to overwrite something. I can edit in the timeline more, in context to the other clips around it. The 3 point edit style kickback to reel to reel editing I don’t need to see ever again.

But I understand the one major flaw of X is the export of audio to ProTools, etc. Whereas video tracks are meaningless, because the end result is simply one single video image, audio is different. Tracks equate to channels. And this seems to be the biggest hurdle of this software for some and their workflows, especially regarding export to XML/ProTools.

Which brings me to an idea I haven’t heard. How about if X had a simple audio mix mode, where it brings up a window with a single video track, with the audio all separated onto tracks, where you can clean up and organize for ProTools? Seems doable. Perhaps the window could even be a “room” while you’re editing? So you can edit in the quicker way, but then pop open this sorta “export prep” or “audio mix” mode where it puts the audio on tracks based on connections and roles, but you can adjust to your liking, or mix with an mix tool, then pop back into chicklet mode? That would seriously be awesome and doable. Kinda like DaVinci. You have separate rooms. Import (we have that), Edit (we have that) and Audio Mix (where you can’t edit, but it’s a room for mixing the audio or peeping for XML export. The look and feel would probably be more like entering the angle editor for audio. Move audio around freely onto labeled tracks and have a mixer.

[Scott Witthaus]

Avid should look at what it had in DS and start from there. Had the company properly developed that product and /or merged it with Symphony/MC (or at least the ideas and workflow) there would be no need for threads like this. Of course they killed it.

Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter

[Aindreas Gallagher]

[Brett Sherman] ” I find music editing much easier. “

do you not find the system whereby there are no global timeline markers a bit irritating?
Also – and I should check this really, but that if you blade during playback, it always blades all tracks?
Even just those two moronic limitations alone I think I would find pretty infuriating when trying to work effectively with music.
but i guess ymmv.

but there seem to be quite a few things that would really annoy someone about trying to work effectively with music?

[Brett Sherman] “It’s also more efficient with screen space. In FCP 7 I used to devote an entire monitor to the timeline so I could see all the tracks without scrolling up and down.”

It’s odd you should say that – I do find FCPX incredibly inefficient vertically as a timeline. Even the guy on FCPX grill made the point that the timeline was very vertically bloated. Also the fact that you can’t do a true overwrite of a connected clip etc – it always felt a bit stupid and skyscraper-ish as you just keep pressing Q, and it keeps heading higher.

Also the fact that, three years later, there are no keyboard shortcuts for track height is basically the funniest thing I’ve ever heard. I always presumed cupertino was doing that just to drive you all completely insane.

https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics