How does Avid compare with FCP?

[Mark Raudonis]

[alex udell] “Remember, like it or not Avid is the accepted “Standard” when it comes to editing. Any major editing change they make to the editing topology effects the army of already proficient Avid editors out there. So radically changing what “works” for a different approach would probably raise a series of red flags.”

Here in Los Angeles, that standard is changing… like it or not.

I’m old enough to remember when a Grass Valley VP-141 driving 3 one inch VTR’s was the “accepted Standard”. Times change. Standards change.

Two years ago we were all AVID. Today, we’re all FCP/X-SAN. For the one hundred editors working here, the new standard is now FCP.

To suggest that the industry won’t favour FCP because an army of Avid editors fear change is missing the point. Change is driven precisely by those who don’t care about the status quo. There are too many advantages that FCP brings to the table compared to Avid to ignore.

Mark

[Will Oswald]

To be honest coming from a film then Lightworks background but now using Avid because “it is the standard” i.e. they had the best sales team, I find it odd that people like editing on a keyboard at all. I don’t play my MS flight sim without a joystick! The manipulation of clips and frames and sound is vastly improved with a good tactile interface. As to FCP I am this very week renting a machine and starting to teach myself with my trusty “FCP for Avid Editors” book. Looks fairly similar operationally but I’m not so sure organisationally when one is on a large project. Avid was always very good at effects, Lightworks at editing, FCP ???. I’m a freelance editor and I have to follow the producers and moneymen – long hours and RSI here we come. Finally in the UK the news that the BBC, a big employer, is going to FCP in a big way forces my hand, I have to be able to use it – however they are trying to get rid of the profession of editing althogether – the producers/ directors will be cutting their own stuff, they call them Preditors – in order to save money. Oh Hum!

[Tom John]

Those who can’t do… teach.
Those who can’t teach… teach gym.
Those who can’t teach gym… become Producers.

So how could a Producer EVER become a REAL Editor? *wink*

(Apologies to Woody Allen)

Tom Weisel
Palm Springs, California
DesertVideo@earthlink.net

[Les Kaye]

[alex udell] “I think Avid has been quite innovative in terms of their approach to moving away from dedicated boardsets to the external hardware that currently drives their product line. Scalable peformance is also a really nice innovation.”

Um, I think this is in response to FCP being there first in many wayws (not the external hardware part of the equation. IMHO, they both have their advantages, but I find myself preferring FCP (which btw, has much in common with edit*).

[Paul Brubacher]

Hi Alex, I remember your name for the edit forum. I am looking into purchasing 3 adrenaline systems to replace my edit 6 systems. I’m having a hard time finding reviews on this product. Can you give me the run down (non-sales) of what this system can and cannot do.
Thanks,
Paul

[Alex Udell]

Hi Paul…

why don’t I turn the question around…

What are you trying to accomplish?

Then we can discuss if the Avid handles that task more elegantly than any other solution.

Alex Udell
lead demo artist and trainer
PEI Graphic Technology http://www.profileeast.com
My Reel: https://alexudell.no-ip.biz
COMBUSTION EXCHANGE FTP: ftp://combustionexchange.no-ip
Logon: combustion_user
PW: learn

[Alex Udell]

Hi…

Well I’ll take your comment to heart. And I’m thinking hard about it.

But think about this for a second….

The reason why Apple has made an impact in such short order is because they were willing to give away “professional” features at rock bottom prices….this is not the “revolution” Apple perpetrates it to be, but rather simple economics of scale.

This doesn’t mean the features are NOT good, or that Apple has not implemented them well, or embellished or expanded on certain areas. However, it has caused significant problems in the market place, both on the side of manufacturers and for the profession of editing in general. I think there has been a perception that all this democratization has made it harder for skiled and accomplished indusrty veterans to make a living and feed their families. Just becuase the technology is widely available doesn’t mean everyone is an “editor.” It’s the desktop publisihing revolution all over again. (How many ugly fonts can you fit on a page?)

In one instance Avid has themselves to blame. A farily expensive solution with a not so shiny “after the sale” track record with customers…but this is to be expected when you are the ONLY game in town. You will protect your margins as long as possible. It’s not unlikely that you will become complacent. Competition will shake you and wake you up…or you will perish.

All that aside…

basically what I was saying…was that for Avid to drop their “metaphor” for editing in favor of copying Apple it not likely to happen…partucularly with the established base of editors used to that metaphor is so large.

People aren’t switching to Apple becuase they have so many great features that Avid doesn’t. Desktop editing is now a MATURE market. Not much new under the sun. It’s a combination of price and the legacy attitudes that complacency has created.

The only long term problem I see is that video is a market “segment” for Apple to sell it’s OS and its hardware. When that segment becomes unprofitable….perhaps they’ll just sell more ipods and forget all about it….

[Les Kaye]

[Alex Udell] “The reason why Apple has made an impact in such short order is because they were willing to give away “professional” features at rock bottom prices….”

This is not quite true any longer Alex. So yes. While you’re correct that FCP’s pricing structure has had an impact on the post world, IMHO, it’s success is no longer due to its cost, and if anything, I’d say Avid is playing catchup – and not just on pricing.

We made the switch from Adrenaline HD simply because FCP IS the superior solution for our needs – realtime multicam HD playback (couldn’t even do SD multicam PB in Adrenaline), MUCH faster rendering (seconds and minutes vs. hours), more powerful (and IMHO superior) gfx and fx handling via LiveType and Motion, and finally – better customer support from Apple (although our Avid dealer was great – Avid was – shall we politely say, not as responsive.

Avid certainly has SOME superior features that I miss, but I also prefer FCP’s less modular and more contextual workflow (similar to edit’s), to Avid’s now dated modal paradigm, and no doubt FCP will pick up the slack on what it’s missing. I was in no rush to move to FCP, but NONE of us have no regrets now that we have. I’m sure the same is true for others.

[Alex Udell]

Hi Les…

Good chat…I love the banter…you know that.

I’ve spent little time on FCP over the last few years. That’s about to change soon. I’m sure I will agree with you that just like ANY system I sit down at now. I will find some stuff I realy like and some things maybe not so much.

The “rigidity” of the Avid workflow has a certain appeal from a long form perspective, and the media management in terms of consolidation, prjoect archiving, and media restoration, also seems top notch to me. (limited comparison at this point)

I’m not particularly a fan of the way you handle FX stacking in Avid and graphics also “feels” limited…but that’s just a feel at this point.

Believe me, my point here is not to knock Apple….but they are not the greatest thing since sliced bread that Apple marketing aura makes them out to be.

I’ll find things about them are very cool…and then the things that are….well…not so much. 🙂

the fun is in the learning….

cheerio,

Alex Udell
lead demo artist and trainer
PEI Graphic Technology http://www.profileeast.com
My Reel: https://alexudell.no-ip.biz
COMBUSTION EXCHANGE FTP: ftp://combustionexchange.no-ip
Logon: combustion_user
PW: learn

[Paul Brubacher]

I work for a church and do a half hour TV program as well as Inhouse video’s. I currently have two edit 6 station tied together through a San system that we use for the broadcast. And one more stand alone station for church video’s. Media Management is very important for me as well as stability because I make Beta copies for the stations right off the timeline. I would like the ability for 3 station to be able to work on any project all at the same time.
Thanks,
Paul