How do you measure the transfer rate of a network ?

[Bob Zelin]

AJA System Test
click on Preferences, and enable Network Drives (it’s a check box)
then run it.

Yes, it’s a free download from https://www.aja.com

there is NOTHING wrong for ethernet for DVCProHD. DVCProHD (which is 100Mb/sec) requires 13.9 Mb/sec
https://www.dulcesystems.com/html/video_space.html
this is one of countless charts that you can see the thruput required for data transfer. Blackmagic, AJA, and others all have charts or data tools like this.

Ethernet will give you 50Mb/sec, ethernet with jumbo frames will give you 70Mb/sec (and greater, but 70Mb/sec min). So there is no issue putting 13.9Mb/sec into a 70Mb/sec data pipe.

12 FCP systems, all doing 13.9 Mb/sec will require a pipe of
168Mb/sec. Fibre channel has a 4 gig pipe to the drive array. So does a link aggregated switch back to a server with 4 ethernet ports with Jumbo frames enabled.

Is the bandwidth to each FCP client greater with an ATTO 42ES Fibre channel card – absolutely. But you don’t need this for DVCProHD back to a single client.

If you demand Fibre, may I suggest Facilis Terrablock, any day over horrible Apple XSAN.

Bob Zelin

[Francois Xavier]

thank you for the fast ” Zelin answer”

much appreciated

Aja system test was my first attempt but I missed “Network drive” option. (duh !)
so know I will get back to it.

Documentary Director & Editor
Paris /France

[Francois Xavier]

although … (can not edit my post anymore)

those guys are not editing shared storage they work LOCAL and transfer… (don’t ask)

ok I might as well spit it. it’s a broadcast facility, ok ? for cable Tv (sort of)

they have a very slow ethernet network, shared by anybody who goes on line, download …

so they work on local storage for each station, do all rendering, export and transfer finished file to central storage and then omneon for broadcast.

So… – hold on to your seat – they work XdCam Hd to have lighter files , oui Monsieur ! Long Gop ! with all the rendering and re-conforming hassle. ( Although they do actually shoot in DvcPro HD on P2 ! even more rendering time ) so the whole thing is a nightmare.

so I am telling them… at least go fiber. your FILES transfer rate will go up. My question is about how many times higher ?

and them I will lead them to central shared storage.

[Bob Zelin]

you write –
those guys are not editing shared storage they work LOCAL and transfer… (don’t ask)

REPLY – I don’t need to ask. This is the way that MANY houses work – Bunim Murray in LA works with way with a Fibre 100 seat XSAN system – edit local, and transfer to central shared storage. This is the way that Disney Broadcast Operations in Orlando, FL. is using my system – the shared storage is being used for all the “B roll” footage, and they still edit to local drives.

ok I might as well spit it. it’s a broadcast facility, ok ? for cable Tv (sort of)

REPLY – what is wrong if you split it? Is this a contest ?

they have a very slow ethernet network, shared by anybody who goes on line, download …

REPLY – my system will not work without a DEDICATED ETHERNET NETWORK, which means that EVERY MAC must have a DEDICATED ETHERNET PORT that supports jumbo frames (like ethernet port 2 on a MAC Pro).
If you have old MAC G5’s, you get a card (like a Small Tree PXG1D) that supports jumbo frames. Who cares what their existing ethernet network is. Cabling is the # 1 CONCERN of installing any new equipment. I would never have learned how to do any of this, if my labor charge of cabling up a facility was not involved. I write about this kind of shared storage, so people will hire me to cable up their facilities – everything from ethernet, to audio, to video. All this “techno stuff” on user forums is just babble to me. Cabling up a facility, or adding new cabling (for ethernet, fibre, etc.) is where the money is for me. If they have a “slow” ethernet network, install a new ethernet network, that is dedicated, and hi speed. It will work. You will do the same for fibre – with fibre cable, and fibre switches.

so they work on local storage for each station, do all rendering, export and transfer finished file to central storage and then omneon for broadcast.

REPLY – nothing wrong with this.

So… – hold on to your seat – they work XdCam Hd to have lighter files , oui Monsieur ! Long Gop ! with all the rendering and re-conforming hassle. ( Although they do actually shoot in DvcPro HD on P2 ! even more rendering time ) so the whole thing is a nightmare.

REPLY – what is the nightmare ? Disney Broadcast Operations uses XDCam HD. Nothing wrong with it. Most people that use MAC /FCP will ultimately use the Apple ProRes422 codec, or the DVCProHD codec, even if they work in Sony XDCam. NO ONE works in native HDV format, even if they shoot on HDV.

so I am telling them… at least go fiber. your FILES transfer rate will go up. My question is about how many times higher ?

REPLY – you are giving them wrong information. You like fibre. Nothing wrong with fibre – it works great. It just costs more money.
there is an old joke – what weighs more – 100 pounds of feathers, or 100 pounds of gold ? they both weigh 100 pounds. What is faster – DVCProHD across Fibre, or DVCProHD across ethernet – they are both 13.9 Mb/sec – so they will travel as fast on either format.

and them I will lead them to central shared storage.

REPLY – if you like Fibre, I suggest Facilis Terrablock. Excellent product. If you want to do it yourself, you will need an ATTO 42ES in each MAC, a QLogic Fibre siwtch (like a SANbox), lots of fibre cable, fibre arrays, a metadata server, and seats of XSAN for each system.

If you thing that spending $200,000 for a Fibre XSAN system will be a seemless, simple, unmanaged system, that everyone can render to, write to and share from, with no issues, you are in for a big surprise.

Bob Zelin

[Francois Xavier]

thank you great infos

– YOUR Reply – what is the nightmare ?

The Nigthmare is that Long Gop renders and exports do more than double the process.
For a Two Hours program that’s two hours… more waiting, several times a day.

-Your Reply – there is an old joke – what weighs more – 100 pounds of feathers, or 100 pounds of gold ? they both weigh 100 pounds. What is faster – DVCProHD across Fibre, or DVCProHD across ethernet – they are both 13.9 Mb/sec – so they will travel as fast on either format.

So far I am talking about transfering… rendered finished FILES. Absolutly not about video to play back reliably.

and that other subject, (shared central storage) having being reading you or Walter Biscardi on this very site, one could thing Ethernet Final Share is a great solution but for 4 or 5 work stations. Maybe I should read more…

Reply – If you thing that spending $200,000 for a Fibre XSAN system will be a seemless, simple, unmanaged system, that everyone can render to, write to and share from, with no issues, you are in for a big surprise.

Gosh … What makes you think that’s my believe ? hum… no that’s ok, thank you for your expert time and affability

Documentary Director & Editor
Paris /France

[Mike Most — account bouncing, bad address]

>DVCProHD (which is 100Mb/sec) requires 13.9 Mb/sec
>Ethernet will give you 50Mb/sec, ethernet with jumbo frames will give >you 70Mb/sec (and greater, but 70Mb/sec min). So there is no issue >putting 13.9Mb/sec into a 70Mb/sec data pipe.

Bob, you’re probably confusing a lot of people by freely using “Mb” to represent both megaBITS and megaBYTES. The common nomenclature is Mb for megaBITS, and MB for megaBYTES. They are not the same thing (not even close) and need to be differentiated if people are to make any sense of what you’re saying.

For example, translating what you have posted above, what it should say is:
DVCProHD (which is 100Mb/sec) requires 13.9 MB/sec.
Ehernet will give you 50MB/sec, ethernet with jumbo frames will give you 70MB/sec..

etc.

[Francois Xavier]

thank you Mike for clearing I was starting to feel a little confuse, (I am a video guy, not a network guy, but I need some basic info… so I can act )

and I still don’t have my answers, so let’s reformulate, (I am ONLY talking about transfer of rendered files)

1 – What decent TRANSFER speed can I expect to be delivered to me over ethernet ? Like… under that it’s a joke. 70 Mb/sec ? is that right ? I guess in the case of ethernet it is divided by the number of seats transferring at the present time ? so how long should take a 30 GB file to be transfered in that perfect world ? Those Megabits and MegaBytes arn’t decimal.. are they ? I am sure I would do the maths wrong

2 – I still can’t measure the network I suspect to be lazy. The Aja test won’t see that “dpshare” volume on the desk although I have enabled ” distant volumes ” on it’s preferences. ( It’s a shared volume on an exanet server. So, is there an other tool ?

thank you all

Documentary Director & Editor
Paris /France

[Mike Most — account bouncing, bad address]

The math is very simple. 70MB/sec = approx. 4GB/min. So, for your 30GB, that’s a little under 8 minutes. The 70MB/sec is not aggregate bandwidth, it is bandwidth per 1Gb connection. So if your server has 4 gigabit ports trunked together, you could reasonably expect 4 clients, each with a 1Gb connection, to be able to pull somewhere close to 70MB/sec each. That’s an aggregate bandwidth of 70×4, or 280MB/sec, provided the disk array that is serving as the central storage can supply that, and assuming the server itself doesn’t add considerable overhead (it shouldn’t). Adding clients beyond that will, of course, impact the ability of each to achieve this number, but only if all of the clients are pulling material at the same time – hence the logic of working locally and copying to the central server.

Bob, feel free to correct me if I’m wrong.

[Francois Xavier]

thanks Mike this is exactly what I needed, could’nt be clearer

Documentary Director & Editor
Paris /France

[Bob Zelin]

Francoir –
This is amazing. You wrote –
“It’s a shared volume on an exanet server”

I just got contacted by Exanet a few minutes ago. Are you telling me that their NAS system is not fast enough to pass video across your network ? They just told me that it was ! We are doing nothing special here – just link aggregating some ethernet ports into a managed switch, enabling jumbo frames, and using a fast drive array. The Exanet seems pretty fancy from their website – are you saying that you can’t get video to play back over what you have now ?

If you are on a normal ethernet network, AJA System test should absolutely be able to measure the speed over a network drive, by simply going to the PREFERENCES menu in AJA System Test, and clicking on the checkbox to enable network volumes.

Bob Zelin