HDSDI time lapse

[Ray Palmer]

Can I suggest another approach?
We have a Varicam and we also do a lot of Timelapse work.
When possible, we like to use Digital Still cameras for our time lapses. It frees up the Varicam and depending on the location, we can fit the still camera in better locations. The still cameras can capture in a higher resolution than we can get with our Varicam.
We then take the still files into After Effects and make a movie. It works great.
The Rebel and some other Digital Still cameras can take a contact closure to take a picture. We use a simple timer relay that we can set to any time cycle you can imagine.

Check out https://www.timelapsetechnologies.com

Ray Palmer, Engineer
Salt River Project
Phoenix, AZ
602-236-8224 office
There are three types of people in this world, those that can count and those that can’t.

[Kevin O’brien]

Yes, Thanks for this suggestion.
I already use a Canon 20D to do time lapse this way.
Do you shoot RAW or Jpeg for your time lapse?
I have done jpeg but seemed to get banding in the sky.
RAW uses up the card very fast.
Was hoping to use the Varicam as a second source without the mechanism wear of tape time lapse.
Could get another still body, but have been doing time lapses of 6 hours and more, and still camera can’t hold enough frames. Maybe a large CF card would get it.
Thanks.

[Gary Adcock]

[Kevo] “Was hoping to use the Varicam as a second source without the mechanism wear of tape time lapse. “

the problem being that the Varicam can only do bursts at 10 frames to tape, and only the hardware FRC can extract the dupe frames, it cannot be done correctly in FCP or AVID.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD

[Kevin O’brien]

Hi Gary,
I beg to differ somewhat.
I have sometimes captured time lapse that Final Cut did not recognise as such.
Applying a 1000% speed change without frame blending successfully takes 1 frame of each 10 frame burst and creates a smooth time lapse.
What I am looking for is a plug-in that would allow Final Cut to capture single frames, the way premiere once did.
Then I bypass the tape process and go straight into the computer.

[Gary Adcock]

[Kevo] ” have sometimes captured time lapse that Final Cut did not recognise as such.
Applying a 1000% speed change without frame blending successfully takes 1 frame of each 10 frame burst and creates a smooth time lapse.”

Like I said FCP cannot do it directly,

Doing a speed change in FCP is not the same as capturing the unique frames, since the Varicam is giving you 10 sequential frames at the interval you have indicated- which is not the same as one frame at the same interval – it is not the same type of motion.

Use P2 cameras for time lapse – they can do this correctly without the post hassle of handling the multiple frames.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD

[Kevin O’brien]

Well, I must beg to differ again.
When the 10x speed change is applied to Final Cut without frame blending, the result is the same as a p2 time lapse: each frame unique and the interval remains the same. You’ve ditched 9 of 10 frames in each burst. The remaining one preserves the original interval intent. The motion is the same as a p2 time lapse with the same interval.

Yes, P2 is the future, and as I look back at the Varicam that cost nearly $100,000 just for body and lens 2 years ago, it is with some chagrin to see the 900 with firewire out and 500 with p2 at disturbingly lower prices.
Still for me P2 is not viable until I can do a days worth of shooting on a set of cards.
Even then, my clients frequently want to catch a plane, train or automobile out of town with the footage at the end of the day. There is no time in the shedule to transfer hours of footage. Tacked on Hard drive systems are not the answer. For now, tape is not yet dead.

Thanks,
Kevo

[Gary Adcock]

[Kevo] “When the 10x speed change is applied to Final Cut without frame blending, the result is the same as a p2 time lapse: each frame unique and the interval remains the same. You’ve ditched 9 of 10 frames in each burst.”

Sorry Kevo,
but setting FCP to do a 10x speed change does not discard frames it takes the 10 frame burst and makes it 100 frames, it does not discard any of the redundant frames. There is no way that speed changes in the Apple software can match the look of the same content as it was originally acquired.
– with a AutoDesk or Quantel system I could believe, but not with FCP

While your method may work for your initial burst on tape, what happens when the interval is changed to a longer time period and it has run for 12 hours or more?

And while this may look correct like it is correct to you, it is NOT the same as using a true intervalometer setting with the hardware FRC.
Note that the H and F model cameras can also respond differently, depending on whether you have turned on certain functions in the service menus, shutter angles and number of frames being captured.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD

[Kevin O’brien]

Well Gary,
I still don’t agree.
First I have to question your basic math.
You said “setting FCP to do a 10x speed change does not discard frames it takes the 10 frame burst and makes it 100 frames.” That would be a 1/10 speed change or 10%.
Setting FCP Modify>Speed (percent) to 1000, which is a 10x speed change from 100 percent, gives you 10 frames from 100. Perhaps this is just a semantic confusion.

Can’t speak to Autodesk or Quantel as I have no experience with them. Have not used an Auricon lately either.

If you think FCP speed change (with frame blending off)and a 1000 setting is doing something other than tossing the frames that are unused, maybe you can get some FCP guru to explain to me what that would be. I’d be interested to hear it.

Then you go on say”your method may work for your initial burst on tape” which seems to contradict everything you’ve said up to this point.

Then you ask, “what happens when the interval is changed to a longer time period and it has run for 12 hours or more? ” Well, nothing. The interval is independent of the burst rate and only the burst rate would affect what factor you would use to eliminate extra frames.
As for the 12 hours, I assume you mean time code. Code is of limited use and with time lapse I don’t keep it, so it is of no consequence for me.

I’ve asked Steve Mahrer of Panasonic to shed some light on the hardware FRC vs. my Final Cut method, as I don’t have much experience with the hardware FRC.

You said, “Note that the H and F model cameras can also respond differently, depending on whether you have turned on certain functions in the service menus, shutter angles and number of frames being captured. ”
I can see how shutter angle would affect the look of the shot.
Number of frames being captured would be burst rate, we talked about that.
if there are other items in the service menus that would affect time lapse in a non-obvious way I’d love to learn about them.
Please be as specific as you can.
With 257 menu items in the Varicam, it seems there is always something left to learn about, at least for me.

Thanks,
Kevo

[Gary Adcock]

[Kevo] “I’ve asked Steve Mahrer of Panasonic to shed some light on the hardware FRC vs. my Final Cut method, as I don’t have much experience with the hardware FRC. “

Then ask Steve his opinion of my knowledge of FCP and process workflow we are talking about.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD

[John Christie]

Kevo

Check out BTV Pro

https://www.bensoftware.com/btvpro.html

It’s a bit old now, but it supports any video input that Quicktime can see.

Cheers

John Christie