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HD Killing Cinematography?
This may not be the right forum for my concern, but I don’t know where else to post it within CC.
I apologize if my concern is so “yesterday” and I would appreciate it if you direct me to past threads on this.
I finally get around to getting a flat screen HD monitor and blu-ray player ( Samsung 46” LED , Series 6-6400, 1080p, Sony Blu-ray BDP-S370/BX37.) I install and throw on a blu-ray as well as a traditional DVD. The large screen is nice, the clarity is good and I like the rich colors. Yet, I am astounded at what I am not seeing. It feels like I am no longer watching a film. It feels like I am on the actual set of the movie watching the making of, taped on video. The lighting schemes become more obvious, some of the special effects start to look cheesy. In short the illusion and magic of film is gone. I could go on an on about this. For sports on TV or documentaries, I can see the advantage. But, my first impression of HD for movies is a disaster.
So, are my settings on the monitor or the Blu-Ray player simply wrong somewhere?
Or, did I lose something precious went I put away my analog monitor, which I am never going to get back?
Eric
P.S I did tweak the contrast and deepened the blacks, but this did not resolve the issue explained above.
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16 Replies
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You problem is your TV, it is an 120Hz monitor that takes away the 24P feel and makes everything look like soap opera.
Great for sports, sucks for movies.
Emre Tufekci
http://www.productionpit.com -
Yep, those high-Hz monitors are the work of the devil.
They think they are doing you a favor by interpolating the so-called “missing” frames in 24p footage, but those frames aren’t missing… they were never meant to be there. Saw a bit of “Pirates of the Carribean” on one in a store, it looked like the world’s most expensive home movie.
Great for sports, terrible for drama.
T2
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Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
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Many thanks for the responses. So, what it the solution? Can you recommend a set that won’t turn Laurence of Arabia into the Soap channel?
Eric
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I’m continuing the thread here. Just came back from an electronic store where I compared the same LED set with one having the 60Hz refresh rate and one with the 120 Hz refresh rate and indeed the 60Hz rate looks “normal” whereas the 120 Hz rate looks like it was shot on my home camcorder. AMAZING!
Once again, the consumer gets left in the dark. I am also surprised that the movie industry is not on top of this. After all, each time you look at a movie and it looks like crap, you are devaluing your product.Eric
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You SHOULD be able to select back down to 60Hz if you want. Check your manual. I’m saying this because the sales demo (at a retailer that will be unnamed) guy was switching back and forth to show us how much ‘better’ the crap looked. Give it a try, or return your TV for one that will.
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Carlton,
Thanks for the suggestion. But, unfortunately the box to this set says “Auto Motion Plus, 120 HZ” and there is not even a mention of an option for 60Hz in the manual. I am going to be returning this model.
I must add that I am still in disbelief that I have run into this issue. I wonder how many other people have also dealt with this and how many will just live with a set that makes everything look like the Soap Channel.Eric
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Interestingly, I read a thread just the other day talking about how one of the afternoon soaps changed to shooting 24P. The audience was so upset with the look that the production changed back to 60i. Apparently, the show didn’t look “real” anymore. Go figure.
John
MacPro 8-core 2.8GHz 8 GB RAM OS 10.5.8 QT7.6.4 Kona 3 Dual Cinema 23 ATI Radeon HD 3870, 24″ TV-Logic Monitor, ATTO ExpressSAS R380 RAID Adapter, PDE enclosure with 8-drive 6TB RAID 5
FCS 3 (FCP 7.0.2, Motion 4.0.2, Comp 3.5.2, DVDSP 4.2.2, Color 1.5.2)Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO & 192 Digital I/O, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neumann U87, Schoeps Mk41 mics, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN
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Eric,
I just checked out a(nother) forum–is your TV a Samsung?–and one guy stated that he put it in ‘game mode on’ and that put it back to 60Hz for when he wants to watch movies. Give it a try (and let me know how it goes). Other than that, beware of retailers and the crap gimmicks they’re trying to pawn.
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Carlton,
Thanks for your post. This model WAS a Samsung and I was so disappointed that I returned it. I visited another store where a salesman told me that you can actually turn off the 120 Hz on that set. He did on the floor model but the image still had a weird feel to it.
I have decided to do more research before getting a new set.
I’m curious how this issue is going to play out. Has this issue not made a lot of noise yet because people are using older HD set with 60Hz?
While inspecting monitors at the store today, the one set that seemed to give out a correct image was a 60Hz model that is probably considered old by now.
Eric
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I was just looking at new TVs last night, and I concur that the 120hz mode with motion smoothing is insanely annoying on a 24p film. I can’t imagine that there’s any models which DON’T have a way to disable it; if there are, that’s pretty sad.
Supposedly, a 120hz set with motion smoothing turned OFF still has an advantage when viewing 24p material. It can use 5:5 pulldown from a 24p Blu-Ray (repeating each frame 5x) instead of 3:2 pulldown like most televisions, so telecine judder is eliminated and it gives it motion characteristics like watching a film in a theater. So, there is a bright side to this gimmicky tech.
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