Film workflow ideas

[Jeremy Garchow]

-I’d get the RAM, even if you personally have to buy it.

-Does the audio have matching tc? If so, look in to syncing in RCX. Synced clips in FCPX don’t carry tc (all clips start at 00:00..), and FCPX multiclips that do carry tc have issues with XML/Resolve. You can aways conform back in RCX to whatever you want and generate multiple interchanges if you need to. RCX also offers manual audio sync.

-50 hours doesn’t seem like that much material. You can always break off smaller parts if needed, but I’d keep it all in one Event, and backup. I find the making duplicates in FCPX is an easy way to backup, even though it takes a little longer.

-Sharing can be done through Project XML ( if you don’t want to dupe Events/Projects), but it will create new Events. You can always copy the material you need over (keywords and such) and modify Event references from the imported/shared event to the Main Event(s).

-Test. Then test again.

[Oliver Peters]

[Jeremy Garchow] “Does the audio have matching tc?”

Unknown. Production starts in two weeks. If things go according to plan, the two REDs (A&B cams) will have matching code (but I bet it will drift and won’t be perfect). But there will also be extra cams, like 5D and GoPro and Epic. These may not be important for sync sound. Don’t know till I see it.

[Jeremy Garchow] “50 hours doesn’t seem like that much material.”

True, but I’ve had X bog down with a lot less.

[Jeremy Garchow] “Sharing can be done through Project XML ( if you don’t want to dupe Events/Projects), but it will create new Events. You can always copy the material you need over (keywords and such) and modify Event references from the imported/shared event to the Main Event(s)”

Sort of my plan if I don’t bail and just stick with MC7.

– Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com

[Jeremy Garchow]

[Oliver Peters] “but I bet it will drift and won’t be perfect)”

RCX has methods to deal with this, but they are manual, not automagic, including offsets.

[Oliver Peters] “Sort of my plan if I don’t bail and just stick with MC7.”

Jump on in, the water is tepid. 🙂

[Oliver Peters]

[Jeremy Garchow] “Jump on in, the water is tepid. :)”

Although the challenge is admittedly attractive, this is low budget. If I get in and X becomes a road block, I eat it time-wise. Media Composer is rock solid, as is FCP 7.

– Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com

[Jeremy Garchow]

But how much fun is stable? It is not as fun as fast and loose, in spite of any hangovers.

[Bill Davis]

What Jeremy said.

Look, if you just need to get it the dang project done. Nobody here’s gonna give a second thought if you just do it with a package you already know you can depend on.

Using X (for you right now) would be as much about personal growth and experimentation as it would be about just editing the darn movie.

So , in my mind, the reasons to try X would be…

A – X is Apple’s future and that Apple will remain a truly significant player in editing in the next 10 years
or B – that the new bifurcated process represented in X where the association of the Event Browser database with the editing module opens up new possibilities in agile, in-program editing organization that MIGHT help you with a project like this (or not!) hard to tell in advance!
or C – you just want to know more about how X works on a practical level doing the kind of work you do.

Then it makes a lot of sense to use X.

Only you know which mode makes the most sense.

Nothing wrong with playing it safe and just getting the darn job done well and on-time. That’s the bread and butter of our entire industry.

And nothing wrong with taking a chance to dive more deeply into either X (or Premier for that matter!) – whichever you feel will best prepare you for how you see editing evolving in the next few years.

You not only have multiple good choices, you have a large community on the Cow that will be happy to help you overcome stumbling blocks – no matter which path you take.

Exciting times to be an editor, I say!

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.

[Michael Garber]

The last two projects I worked on were commercials – the first was a 2-camera multicam shot on Alexa (800 clips total) with lots of slow-mo and 5D footage. The second spot was a single cam shot on RED.

Both spots were shot with matching timecoded audio and video. I used Sync-n-Link to match everything up. Very fast and easy to use. If there is any sync offset, it will handle it based on you telling it the number of frames.

I recommend keeping the media in it’s own folder and not allowing FCP to import the footage into the Events folder. This will keep the events and projects “multi-user friendly.”

With the RED footage, open up all the clips in REDCineX first and save all the RMDs into the native folders. This way, if you make any changes to them in FCP, they will port over to Resolve.

I think it’s best to let FCP handle the proxy transcoding.

Can’t say that I recommend the Mac Pro with the 5870 card. If they can spring for a new iMac, then go for it. I was editing with the native RED R3Ds without transcoding on the iMac and also on my rMBP without any problems. Just some slow renders. But *very* fast renders with the Alexa 4444 footage.

I had some issues with spots that used the Alexa-based 2-camera multiclips. Major system slowdowns. This was possibly because I had a 3rd angle with footage from the 5D. That issue has gone mostly unresolved.

On the project shot on RED, I was very meticulous in the way I logged. Skimmed every shot and keyworded based on scene. Then I added the Scene_Take# into the keyword’s notes field on each shot, especially if it was a series.

I’m just coming off both of these projects tonight and stepping on a plane in the wee hours of the morning. So I’m just throwing a bunch of info without reading it back. I’d be happy to elaborate more if you want to contact me directly.

Michael Garber
5th Wall – a post production company
Blog: GARBERSHOP
My Moviola Webinar on Cutting News in FCP X

[Mathieu Ghekiere]

Hi Oliver,

difficult to say. You are working with an older Mac that can’t completely leverage the power of FCPX (or vice versa).

I have an older 2010 iMac 8GB RAM at home. It does just okay, with FCPX.

We have tricked out Retina MBP’s at work, 16GB RAM, 1GB VRAM. They are a DREAM to edit on. Rock solid with FCPX 10.0.8. I’m always surprised with the speed of these things.
Yes, even working with R3D material over an Ethernet-connected server, and even making proxies in FCPX is going fast on the Retina’s.

But if you are having problems once in a while on FCPX on your hardware, you know you will curse probably many times. You also will be glad a couple of times you went with FCPX, I still think it’s an unbelievable strong contender in many cases.

I don’t know if you have seen Sam Mestman’s tutorials on working with R3D material and Resolve and FCPX and Audio workflow in FCPX… But I would *really* recommend them. They are free, and they aren’t the typical beginners stuff.

https://themovieswemake.com/tutorials/

Pick out all the ones that are about R3D’s, Multichannel audio, Davinci, Compound Workflow, etc. …
Even if you know about how to work with it, I’ve found his tutorials to have small but very good workflow tips. It’s not so much about: “how do you do this”, but more: “how can you use this”.
Let us know how it goes!

[Mike Most]

FCPX will likely be fine and an interesting experience — provided you don’t use multicam clips if you’re planning to reconform in a color grading program (Resolve or anything else). If you think you will use multicam, you’ll be much happier in Avid, where you can collapse them and eliminate groups before sending the AAF off for a Resolve conform.

[Oliver Peters]

Thanks for all the input so far. Feel free to keep it coming. No decisions yet. RAM upgrades are a good possibility, but changing to iMacs would be a no-go. One hitch in working R3D’s directly in X is that I potentially won’t have enough storage to have the complete set of R3Ds online. Plus conversion will be through a RED Rocket card. I really don’t see a big benefit to generating proxies in X versus RCXP, since I’m never going to access the R3D files for any finishing within X. Am I missing something here?

Also there will be no multi cam. I treat these two-camera shoot as unique takes anyway. Besides, I’ve found you are lucky if you get 25% of the b-cam material to be useful. It’s a director thing. They think they need it these days. Editors hate it. Framing and lighting is usually not great. Just more stuff to wade through. 😉

– Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com