FCPX on 5K iMac

[Rick Lang]

David, I don’t think Peter Chamberlain has commented on the iMac 5K 2014 yet, but as you probably know the recently updated Configuration Guide for Mac does not recommend a tricked-out iMac 2013 for 4K. He recommends a minimum of an 8-core Mac Pro with dual D700 GPUs for 4K. This iMac 5K at maximum configuration may well prove to be on the borderline of acceptable for ProRes 4K footage if not a lot of post effects. Especially for short work that can use the 1TB internal flash storage. The renders for h.264 deliverables will be accelerated by the Intel Quick Sync feature, but I have been told that is only used for a single-pass.

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB

[John Rofrano]

Ryan thanks. I will check out that article. I’m not working with 4K or RED, just HD.

What’s driving me is that I’m currently doing work for Boris FX and Boris has asked me to create a set of Boris TV Episodes on Boris Continuum Complete 9 for FCP X. As you might imagine, there is a lot of GPU processing going on with BCC9 and I want to show the plug-ins in the best possible light. Boris uses OpenGL acceleration so I know I need a good GPU as well enough CPU power to drive it. If I go with a 2010 12-Core Mac Pro the fastest “Mac Edition” GPU is the Radeon HD 7950. I assume the iMac 5K has a newer/better GPU and may give me a better editing experience. Then again… maybe I should just save up and get a 6-Core 2013 Mac Pro with Dual D500’s? I wish I could just test this stuff out without having to guess about how everything will perform.

Here are the first 4 Boris TV episodes that have already been released in case your interested what I’m producing. Watch them in HD for a clearer view:

Boris TV, Episode 220: Extruded Text Basics in FCP X, Part I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9OvfjKgZA8
Boris TV, Episode 222: Extruded Text Basics in FCP X, Part II
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S-9mwfTVis
Boris TV, Episode 225: Extruded EPS Basics in FCP X, Part I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY6bcTK_xhY
Boris TV, Episode 226: Extruded EPS Basics, Part II
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmEyogfWLwA
You can see my Mac really struggling in the last episode once I have 5 3D Objects animated across 7 connected clips with particle smoke in the background all at once. lol

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com

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[David Mathis]

Thanks for the info Rick. I currently have a mid 2012 Mac Pro, guess time to upgrade to the new model.

[Jeremy Garchow]

In my experience, as well as Oliver’s, FCPX runs best on the newest generation of hardware, whether that be MacPro, iMac or retina MBP. I edit on both a tube and a rMBP, and I like them both a lot. We still have a few cheese graters, and the difference in UI performance is fairly dramatic.

Of course, if you need giant CPU renders, a chesesegrater will do better than an iMac, but for overall fcpx editing, a new iMac (and of course a new MacPro) will be better.

If getting a tube, go for the dual 700s. It’s not much more money to get the faster chips.

Jeremy

[Nicholas Kleczewski]

I have to agree with Oliver. I just returned from an Apple store and while the screen is beautiful, i was not impressed with the UI performance of the iMac 5k at all. Completely granted, it was an i5 base model. But there was minute lag on the stock 1080p projects and very very bad lag on the 4k footage. To the point where id say it’d be very difficult to do real precision editing with, without pulling out your hair in the process.

They obviously didn’t have the 4k project loaded on the base model Mac Pro, but even the identical 1080p projects that are loaded on both ran noticeably better than the iMac. Basically nothing shocking to report given what they are intended for, I just worry people will buy the iMacs with false sense what they can accomplish.

In my experience, an older Mac Pro is rejuvenated since 10.1’s GPU enhancements. Just need the right video card. Throw a 280X or 680 or above and I feel like it screams right along side a new Mac Pro. Of course FCPX just has the memory leak issues that make you have to restart that no computer fixes.

I’m in the process of purchasing a 2010 12-core MacPro for $1600 off eBay. Putting in at least one 6GB 280X (comparable in theory to a single D700) card for about $350 with external power for $100. Putting in the Apricorn dual SSD card which gives 800 MB’s, with 2 Crucial 960GB SSD’s, total cost for everything $900 (could have done 2 500’s for under $600). Cheap USB 3 card so at least i have some decent I/O ability. So Ill be in for about $3k with this little experiment. Ill have the opportunity to run this set up along side a 8 core D700 nMP and report any positive findings there. It is by no means an Apples to Apples comparison, but a upgraded new 12 core with similar specs plus the 2nd D700 runs $8199.

Director, Editor, Colorist
http://www.trsociety.com

[Ryan Holmes]

[John Rofrano] “I assume the iMac 5K has a newer/better GPU and may give me a better editing experience.”
Keep in mind that the GPU on an iMac is technically a mobile graphics card. They aren’t as robust as what’s in a Mac Pro. And that 5K iMac GPU is driving a 5K display…so your performance, as others have stated, may actually be worse until Apple refines the software and drivers further for a smooth user interaction.

[John Rofrano] “You can see my Mac really struggling in the last episode once I have 5 3D Objects animated across 7 connected clips with particle smoke in the background all at once. lol”

This sounds like it would be challenging for many computers! 🙂

[Jeremy Garchow] “If getting a tube, go for the dual 700s. It’s not much more money to get the faster chips. “

I agree with Jeremy here for sure. It’s only $600 more for the D700’s over the stock D500’s, so get the D700’s! That will be well worth the extra money, if you go that route.

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
@CutColorPost

[Rick Lang]

The 8-core new Mac Pro should be able to digest your raw 4K CinemaDNG in DaVinci Resolve. For those who have the option of working on both the iMac 5K and the new Mac Pro, I do think the iMac would be a pleasure to use as the FCP X edit machine,

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB

[Steve Connor]

[Nicholas Kleczewski] “I have to agree with Oliver. I just returned from an Apple store and while the screen is beautiful, i was not impressed with the UI performance of the iMac 5k at all. Completely granted, it was an i5 base model. But there was minute lag on the stock 1080p projects and very very bad lag on the 4k footage. To the point where id say it’d be very difficult to do real precision editing with, without pulling out your hair in the process.

They obviously didn’t have the 4k project loaded on the base model Mac Pro, but even the identical 1080p projects that are loaded on both ran noticeably better than the iMac. Basically nothing shocking to report given what they are intended for, I just worry people will buy the iMacs with false sense what they can accomplish.
“

I would only worry if someone purchased the i5 model, which is not good enough, the i7 with 4GB card is a different beast entirely.

[John Rofrano]

[Nicholas Kleczewski] “I’m in the process of purchasing a 2010 12-core MacPro for $1600 off eBay. Putting in at least one 6GB 280X (comparable in theory to a single D700) card for about $350 with external power for $100. Putting in the Apricorn dual SSD card which gives 800 MB’s, with 2 Crucial 960GB SSD’s, total cost for everything $900 (could have done 2 500’s for under $600). Cheap USB 3 card so at least i have some decent I/O ability. So Ill be in for about $3k with this little experiment.”

I don’t know where you are finding a 2010 12-core Mac Pro for $1600 (I can’t seem to find “original”ones for less than around $2400) but I am very interested in how your experiment works out as that’s exactly what I was thinking of doing. Since you have a real 8 core D700 nMP to compare it too, I’d really like to know how close it comes.

BTW, you know there are a lot of “Frankin-macs” on eBay. People take 2009 Mac Pro’s and flash the firmware to make ’em look like 2010’s and upgrade the processors and try and pass them off as the real thing. You can usually tell because they have slower memory and GPU’s than what came stock. (The base GPU on a 2010 was the 5770 so any Mac claiming to be a 2010 with a GTX-120 is a 2009 frankin-mac) I usually ask them for the serial number and then look them up on the Apple Care web site and I can tell right away if they are really 2010’s or not. The 2009’s with firmware updates benchmark significantly lower even though the specs seem the same. Just FYI in case you didn’t know because $1600 for a 2010 Mac Pro seems very cheap.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com

[John Rofrano]

[Jeremy Garchow] “We still have a few cheese graters, and the difference in UI performance is fairly dramatic.”

Do you know what GPU the older Mac Pro’s are using? There is a pretty good difference between the stock Radeon 5770 and the 5850 that I have. I’m hoping the 7950 will be even better. I never considered putting a non-Mac Edition card in like the 290 but that’s an idea as well. In my experience, GPU’s can make a big difference and breath new life into an old box.

Here is an interesting article that supports your experience that the new Mac Pro are just plain faster:

Breathing new life into old Mac Pros

The author upgraded a 2012 Mac Pro with SSD’s and a Radeon 7950 and it was still slower than a 2013 Mac Pro with D700’s and in some cases the iMac 27″. Unfortunately, they were comparing an 3.0Ghz 8-core 2013 to a 2.4Ghz 12-core 2012. I think it would have been more fair had they used a 3.06 Ghz 12-core which was the top of the line for 2012’s. Oh well. Interesting reading and lots for me to consider.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com