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FCP X as a database
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[Oliver Peters] “So how does it handle this when all 100 of each have to be online and accessible? I find that when this is the case, the amount of buffering to RAM that X has to do becomes really cumbersome. So it’s not simply a matter of hiding things in a folder, because when you open it (like projects) it takes a long time. Everything has to be ready and skimmable.
Well, YMMV, but in my case X handles it just fine. I agree about the time it takes to load project film strips in the Library… to an extent. But I actually find that it’s gotten much faster with 10.0.6. And, once they’re open they’re open. On a slightly related note… They do need to work on the whole timeline browser back/forward button thing. It gets a little weird sometimes… 😉
[Oliver Peters] Event Manager X is fine, but now you are constantly in a situation of exiting and relaunching the app.”
True, but opening X takes no time at all really, at least compared to 7 and, in my limited recent experience, MC and Pr as well. And to me, it’s much easier to organize giant piles of projects in multiple folders separate from the Event(s) they reference.
In 7, I have projects that take forever to open because they have so many sequences in them. So I have to duplicate the project, trash all the stuff I hopefully won’t need, and move on. Leaving me with 2 or more projects to hunt through if I find I need something old.
And by hunt through, I mean like maybe I had cut a specific shot or little sequence into a spot . 3 months later, I need to find it. In 7, i need to not only find the project version the sequence is in, but if I can’t remember which of the multiple versions of multiple spots it’s in, I need to open them all one by one ’til I find it. In X, just skim through them in the Library. For me, that’s faster and easier…
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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~
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[Oliver Peters] “Not sure it that’s really the best approach.”
Why?
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[Oliver Peters] “[Craig Seeman] “The relationship between Events and Projects”
In what way is this any different than Avid’s bin structure? Each bin, whether it holds sequences or clips is a separate data file on the hard drive. Plus project media is embedded into the media file format.”
The bin structure, btw, is on of the things I’m really digging about MC. I love the way I can move bins between projects, and that the bin retains its own identity. I’m really appreciating the whole notion of a bin as a unit that transcends a project.
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No, changing a master shot CC in an event doesn’t change anything at all in a project. The project is linked to the master event file. You open the project and the project looks at all the master clips in the event. If they’ve been transcoded or switched to proxys, it doesn’t matter. It links to the event, the event keeps track of the media.
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[Bret Williams] “No, changing a master shot CC in an event doesn’t change anything at all in a project. The project is linked to the master event file. You open the project and the project looks at all the master clips in the event. If they’ve been transcoded or switched to proxys, it doesn’t matter. It links to the event, the event keeps track of the media.”
I hear ya, but changing the contents of an Event CC changes all instances of that object wherever it’s used right? At least it’s supposed to in 10.0.6, I haven’t played with that yet. Maybe it is just a one way Project to Event link, but who knows? It just seems to me that the “in what projects is this clip used” info exists somewhere in the Event database, at least if the project is open. And if it does, maybe it’ll be accessible at some point. Or not… 😉
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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~
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I think this is what Phil Hodgetts was trying to get through to me when we talked a lot back in the early days when he was trying to impress on me the importance of metadata “flow” in X. Attributes have a directional flow. From import to the EB, then from the EB into Story lines – and from story lines into the project library.
The further upstream you append metadata the more it’s available for being “handed off” to later processes. So work done in the EB will always feed your projects – where you have the option to strip and change things by removing or appending new metadata to the incoming files.
I think we’re starting to see some conditional data flow back from the project level to the Event Browser (at least as stored compound clip states) but it’s always going to be limited unless we want the central database to get REALLY complex – having to constantly not just watch for metadata changes flowing downstream – but tracking the users state changes upstream as well.
FWIW.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Oliver Peters] “it feels like Apple is trying to do the same thing as they tried with iTunes – namely make it a hub for everything. Not sure it that’s really the best approach.”
[Jeremy Garchow] “Why?”
Bloat and proprietary vendor lock-in for starters, maybe?
_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
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[David Lawrence] “Bloat and proprietary vendor lock-in for starters, maybe?”
Bloat…I think that’s been solved, time to move forward.
Almost all NLEs are proprietary. Can you explain what you mean here?
I agree with Oliver that all NLEs are databases, I am just curious as to why it’s all of a sudden a bad idea to make an NLE a hub. Isn’t that what everyone was so pissed about on day 1? You couldn’t get data in or out of it?
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[Jeremy Garchow] “I agree with Oliver that all NLEs are databases, I am just curious as to why it’s all of a sudden a bad idea to make an NLE a hub.”
I just feel that the iTunes approach involves a walled garden mentality where one application is trying to perform all functions and in the end does most of it badly. For the most part, users who are serious about what they do, don’t want a single all-encompassing application and will tend to opt for a suite of compatible, companion tools. Along those same lines, I have no interest is seeing Resolve add more edit-system-style features either.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
[Jeremy Garchow] “Bloat…I think that’s been solved, time to move forward.”
Bloat with compound clips has been solved well. I’m talking about this:
[Oliver Peters] “Absolutely. One of X’s very big weak points. Right now there is no way to effectively manage (within the application) a production that would generate 100 Events and 100 Projects. I don’t mean the software can’t handle it (though I have my doubts) – rather that the interface does not effectively support it for the operator.”
I think there’s a potential bloat problem with the event and project library databases in situations like Oliver describes. What’s the largest number of projects you’ve had in a library? How was the load performance? I’m curious because I even though I only have a handful of simple test projects, my project library load time is not great.
[Jeremy Garchow] “I am just curious as to why it’s all of a sudden a bad idea to make an NLE a hub. Isn’t that what everyone was so pissed about on day 1? You couldn’t get data in or out of it?”
Can you get tags and keyword collections out of it?
_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl
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