Edius vs. Vegas

[Douglas Spotted eagle]

Edius is able to do this as the result of a proprietary codec (a very good one) that requires conversion of the HDV stream to a non-HDV format, that will then require recompression on output to tape.
IMO, Edius is the next-best choice to Vegas when it comes to non-hardware specific preview and output. What you didn’t see was that not all FX can play back with full frame, full rez preview. Remember, you saw a demo, not a real-world use. I can show you Vegas playing back in real-time, 14 layers of various types of video ranging from 4:4:4 uncompressed HD to animated gifs all on the same timeline, it’s all about the magic of the presentation.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not dissing Edius, because I think it’s a brilliant, although not fully-featured app.

Douglas Spotted Eagle
VASST

Certified Sony Vegas Trainer
Aerial Camera/Instructor

[Ron Shook]

Jerry,

[Jerry Neal] “I saw a presentation on Edius last night at my local videography group. I was amazed to see that you can preview your video (filters, effects, etc.) at full resolution without rendering. This seems to blow every other software out of the water regarding this feature.”

What Douglas said with particular emphasis on this:

[Douglas Spotted Eagle] “I think it’s a brilliant, although not fully-featured app.”

I looked real hard at Edius before settling on Vegas. It has the best real-time software engine of any of the NLE competitors, by a significant edge. It does so by coding for that advantage, by using excellent proprietary intermediate I-frame codecs (like FCP did recently with ProRez), and by avoiding true alpha channel support. Once Grass Valley purchased Canopus, I could see that it wasn’t going to develop in the direction I wanted, i.e., it would never become the craft editor that I was looking for or as Douglas says, a “fully-featured app.”

A craft editor, IMO, must now-a-days have either excellent compositing built in like Vegas, or excellent compositing available via tight integration with companion apps, like the Adobe production studio, and to a somewhat lesser extent FCP Studio. Edius doesn’t have this and very likely never will. What it has is BorisFX bundled, which allows you to get good compositing done, but in a rather cludgy, slow, previous generation manner. What it also has is TitleMotion bundled as a CG/Titler, a big plus, IMO. What I wouldn’t give to have Iscriber CG integrated and bundled with Vegas. (g) The new Vegas Titler covers the TitleMotion part of Inscriber, and is a competitor to LiveType, but no app from Sony, Apple, Adobe, or Avid works as fast, efficiently, and smoothly as the 15 year old Inscriber CG for run of the mill passive character generation tasks like lower thirds, subtitles and such. I hope someone can prove me wrong on this.

What I want in an NLE as a craft editor, may not be what someone else wants or needs. Edius with its superb real-time software engine fits perfectly with what Grass Valley needs as a somewhat crafty news editor for its clients. If what you do in the biz is grind it out, largely cookie cutter event videography or fast paced news with a little flash and a lot of need for speed, Edius might be just your ticket. And please don’t think I’m disparaging anyone’s efforts in the biz. It’s what interests you and pays the bills that count.

Ron Shook
Shoulder-High Eye Productions
CreativeCOW Forum Host for Discreet edit*

[Steve Rhoden]

I do concur with Douglas and Ron,
I myself reviewed Edius extensively and come to the conclusion that
indeed it is unique from other NLE’s and I love the interface…but it
is not a fully-featured editing software as Douglas mentioned.

An example on an impressive note…I Just completed a project for a company that involved 3d tracking into a 3d room environment with the walls created from low resolution image textures with camera walk thru
while rotating, finish off with motion blur and depth-of-field….NOW, tell me, wouldn’t you think something like that can only be done in
a compositing application like after effects or combustion…no, i did it all effortlessly in sony vegas.
Just a small bit of info on how fully featured vegas is and to some extent, only limited by the user.

Steve Rhoden
TNX EFFECTS STUDIOS.

[Adam Rose esq.]

I’m certainly curious to see that, Steve

🙂

[Steve Rhoden]

Trust me Adam,
It is all possible…Remember, vegas does not have 3d camera tracking,
but you can easily create this illusion convincingly along with other numerous tricks right there in vegas using your 3D Source Alpha in
track motion.(trust me you can).
I use velvetmatter for depth-of-field, walk-thru illusion created
using the z axis individually on each (5) image texture that is
rotated and positioned individually to form a room…and keyframing over time each wall during the walk thru to give another illusion
of camera movement while moving forward with a sprinkling of motion blur set at 5% using the video bus track.
Hope my explained method is a little clearer….I use only Combustion
but only find myself opening it up for when i really need intensive shots.

Steve Rhoden
TNX EFFECTS STUDIOS.

[Ron Shook]

Steve,

[steve rhoden] “It is all possible…”

Boy, would I like to see the bang up tutorial you’re gonna write. (g)

Ron Shook
Shoulder-High Eye Productions
CreativeCOW Forum Host for Discreet edit*

[Steve Rhoden]

LOL…Seems im probably spending too much time in vegas.

Steve Rhoden
TNX EFFECTS STUDIOS.

[Chris Young]

Ron ~

Good to see you over here in Vegasland. If you want a titler very much like Inscriber Titlemotion Pro (Oh those halcyon edit* days!) integrated into Vegas look at Cayman Graphics Power CG Plus. Closest thing I have found to do those quick on the fly lower thirds, supers etc. Just works as a plugin. Make any changes in Power CG’s GUI and they update straight away in Vegas as soon as you save. For day to day program work it’s a good tool.

On the old edit* forum you may recall after edit*’s demise, seems a long time ago now, that I said that I was using both Vegas and Edius. Back then I found Edius to be very ‘clunky’. I didn’t use it much after v3.6 because Vegas was a much more sophisticated, capable and satisfying editor to use. Because of a particular client I have lately revisited Edius with v4.6 and in many ways it has improved out of sight since the GV takeover and input. Still much prefer Vegas but Edius has a place in my arsenal. With multi-cam switch it’s way faster and doesn’t drop frame rate like Vegas. Dread to think of trying to do a multi-cam HD job in Vegas. Haven’t tried it yet but I feel pretty sure Edius would kill it in that area.

At any rate great, to see you over here.

Chris Young
CYV Productions
Sydney

[Ron Shook]

Chris,

[Chris Young] “If you want a titler very much like Inscriber Titlemotion Pro (Oh those halcyon edit* days!) integrated into Vegas look at Cayman Graphics Power CG Plus. Closest thing I have found to do those quick on the fly lower thirds, supers etc. Just works as a plugin. Make any changes in Power CG’s GUI and they update straight away in Vegas as soon as you save. For day to day program work it’s a good tool.”

Thank you, I’ll take this recommendation very seriously.

[Chris Young] “Because of a particular client I have lately revisited Edius with v4.6 and in many ways it has improved out of sight since the GV takeover and input. Still much prefer Vegas but Edius has a place in my arsenal. With multi-cam switch it’s way faster and doesn’t drop frame rate like Vegas. Dread to think of trying to do a multi-cam HD job in Vegas. Haven’t tried it yet but I feel pretty sure Edius would kill it in that area.”

I stopped looking at Edius shortly after 4.5 came out and Grass Valley killed the Canopus forum for a couple of months before bringing up their own forums. They didn’t put it this way, but it was essentially a means to discipline their rowdy customers. I kinda decided that I didn’t wanta be in that house, plus the reason I discussed earlier.

It’s great to see comparisons from someone who’s used both softwares professionally and I’m sure others appreciate the insights as well. Comparisons are kinda squirrely because of different software architectures and goals. I’m sure Vegas HD Multi-Cam is just fine if you throw enough computer horsepower at it, but often we aren’t prepared to take that step when the occasional need comes up.

Thanks again,

Ron Shook
Shoulder-High Eye Productions
CreativeCOW Forum Host for Discreet edit*