Editing Film

[Steven Gonzales]

I believe advanced pulldown removal is for video recorded with the special sequencing of the DVX100 2:3:3:2 pulldown.

I think you should use Cinema Tools reverse telecine to get to 23.98 for editing.

[Hordex]

So cut it at 30fps, then use CineTools to convert the list to 24?

[Steven Gonzales]

You could do that, or you could capture the DV files at 29.97, then use Cinema Tools to convert them to 23.98 files with its reverse telecine process and edit at 23.98.

Cinema Tools – file menu – batch reverse telecine

[Hordex]

Thanks Steve, I really appreciate the info.

How would I merge the audio wav files with the video. Should I do it before I reverse telecine?

Thanks again!

[Steven Gonzales]

You can create merged clips in final cut pro after you sync up in the timeline, which is what I usually do. It’s described clearly in the Final Cut Pro user’s manual, under the Help menu.

There is something to consider on sound, however. When film and sound are shot separately, there can be sync issues.

That’s because when film is telecined to video, it is also slowed down. This is because film is 24 fps, and video is 29.97 or 23.976 (23.98) frames per second. So to make frames work out during the transfer, the telecine machine actually projects the film onto video slightly slowed down, at 23.976 frames per second, which will fit in to either 29.97 or 23.76 video rates. If the sound is synced in the telecine, the telecine place gives the sound machine a clock that has a slowed down clock signal, the sound plays slower, and the new video and sound match.

If you sync on your edit system though, you now have sound at its original rate, and film that has been slowed down and reference to video rate (slowed by 1/10th of 1 percent). If you match them up, the sound will go faster, and eventually get ahead of the video at 108 frames per hour.

So in the case where the telecine transfer house doesn’t sync sound and picture, you either have to speed up the video (by taking 23.976 clips, and conforming them to play at 24 — their original speed — and using a 24 fps timeline, OR you have to slow down the audio by 1/10th of 1 percent (.1%, or .99 times its original speed).

The best thing to do is to find out how sound will be finished and where, talk to those people, and work backwards from what they want you to deliver.

[Hordex]

Thank-you Steve and thank-you Dave for your input.

[Daryl K davis]

You should also request telecine logs from your film to tape transfer facility- either Flex Files or ALE (Avid log exchange) files. These are imported into Cinema Tools and batch capture lists can be generated. Saves time in capturing your footage and also ensures footage is captured propoerly on the A-frame for proper reverse telecine cadence.

By the way, I’ve cut over 30 hours TV drama and 5 MOW capturing off DVCAM tapes downconverted at 29.97 NDF from 24p HDCAM masters and editing in 29.97 timeline setup and generated 24p EDL and have never had one problem in either 24p HDCAM on-line or audio post. I don’t get whty everyone gets so freaked out about cutting in 29.97 timeline. I have edited both ways – 29.97 and 23.976 – as well. It sure works nicer looking at 29.97 on NTSC monitor and is easier outputting viewing copies and the like.

[Steven Gonzales]

Daryl, it’s good to know 29.97 works well.

On your projects, was HDCAM the original source, and were the sound files on the tape, or separate?

Thanks for the info.

[Daryl K davis]

2 of the 5 MOW were 35mm transfered to 24p HDCAM, one was 35mm transfer to 29.97 D-Beta and ended with film neg cut and low-con transfer to 24p HD, and 2 were shot 24p HDCAM. For the TV series, two series I did were shot 24p HDCAM, the other was shot super16mm and transfered to 24p HDCAM.

All my inputting into edit system was done off DVCAM tapes – either downconverted from 24p HDCAM or cloned from D-Beta.

I used flx or ALE files for input into Cinema Tools database from telecine facility and creating batch capture list. By the way I request both formats because some anomolies occured at one point with a file from a transfer system (I can’t remember specifically which brand right now) so I think better to be safe. Most telecine also do audio syncing because they also create dailies distribution DVDs which go all over the world to various producers, broadcasters and distributors and it’s much easier that way – more costly mind you.

On 24p HDCAM shot programs my assistants work double hard manually databasing footage and creating batch capture lists for injesting into FCP. They also log audio timecodes and DAT tape numbers into database based on slates so audio EDL can be generated for post audio work. On occasion they post-sync double system shots (eg. steadicam or crane shots where audio can’t be tied into HDCAM. These eventually have to be re-dubbed and sent out as dailies to calm the freaked out producers who think the sky is falling because audio is all crappy from the comsat guide track. Now that is fun.

All in all the problems I’ve had are few and far between – more user error (such as wrong reel number entered) than anything.

Recently have started prepping a 24p HDCAM MOW with backup audio to be recorded by sound recordist as BWF audio files on a computer. This is a new adventure and will see how that goes.

Also have a feature coming up which will be all DI from 35mm telecine to dailies and input files for edit system. Looking forward to that.

[Hordex]

As far as I know, the film will be conformed on a Quantel IQ. Then a IQ to DI transfer.

I hope this all works. I’m going to convert the DVCAM footage through Cinetools to 23.98.

Thanks Everybody.