Edit to Tape Frame Accuracy

[Kristian Lam]

Hi Jon,

Could you drop us an email support[at]blackmagic-design.com?

Thanks

regards

Kristian Lam
Blackmagic Design

[Gene Colburn — email address bounces notices]

Just a hunch here, is the DigiBeta set up to sync to input video or external reference? If you are feeding it an external gen lock reference and using SDI or Analog video, it needs to know what to reference to. (usually input video as a stand alone machine) There numerous menu settings in the DigiBeta that can effect frame edit accuracy, including compensation for edit timing delays.

[Paul Provost]

hey Kristian
have had the same problem on and off for years with different BMD products and FCP to digibetas in different facilities. always intermittent and never resolved.
As of now (decklink extreme/G5 dual/all latest software/10bit projects) the insert alternates between 2 frames early and spot on. so we have to insert twice and then go back and clean up the early insert – a real pain! digibeta A500 is set to sync to input.
You asked Jon to email support – anyway you can post the reply/fix/workaround?
thanks
Paul

[Jon Smitherton]

The response:

“Actually…it is not a frame late. What is actually happening is that it is duplicating the first frame. So you get two ;00 frames. You can see this if you add a timecode generator to your project then export it.

Needless to say. We know about this nasty guy and have a fix for it now. It will be out in the next driver release.”

Would of thought there would be endless complaints about this: Assuming this isn’t happening to anyone – does this mean I’ve got my genlock setup wrong?
Just to double check that I’ve got my leads in the right place; does anyone have a signal flow diagram for Decklink HD (ie with genlock) to Digi? The manual isn’t clear enough.

Thanks
Jon

[Sam Goetz]

Hey Jon,

Indeed, this annoying issue has been well documented on the Cow, but not mentioned recently. It is, as you noted, a confirmed issue and fixes have been promised for some time, but to no avail. There are some simple, yet frustrating, work arounds that will consistently fix the problem. For more info see this thread :

https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/124/866188

Thanks for bringing it up again. And maybe just maybe we’ll see a fix with the new drivers soon. PLEASE!

[Chris Borjis]

I checked this out recently and have the same issue.

One frame late when inserting/assembling to a DVW-500 sony digibeta deck.

Would love to see it fixed.

[Neil Sadwelkar]

The ETT inaccuracy with BM continues. In a multi-FCP, multi deck facility wired with rooms far away from the decks, I’ve managed to tweak specific decks and specific FCPs to come out quite accurate. But never really repeatably accurate.

As an aside, the exact same machine with the BM card installed, also has Avid Media Composer Mojo (Mac version). And using Digital Cut, Avid can layoff to tape accurately, each and every time. So the Mac, the OS, the deck and the genlock have no part in this.

It is the BM serial port and the BM card itself – maybe even FCP.

From my earier post in this thread…
https://forums.creativecow.net/thread/124/866188

This isn’t a workaround, just a precaution.

I often have to lay-off 9 entire film reels (22 mins or so) to tape starting at specific timecodes.
Its very vexing to lay-off a whole reel and then find one is 1 frame late and you find that out only after the entire dump of 22 mins.

So what I do is this.

Connected the output of the deck (with TC burn-in on) to a broadcast monitor so I could see the deck TC burn-in.
Do an ETT.
While the ETT happens, shoot the broadcast monitor screen with a handycam.

Then while the lay-off continues, I rewind the DV tape in the handycam and play it back frame by frame to check if the insert was ‘on time’.
If it is, I let it continue.
If not, cancel ETT and repeat.

This way I know within a minute or so if it is off. Instead of a Handycam you can even use a MacBook Pro with its iSight.

Again, this ain’t a workaround, just means to lessen frustration.

Neil

FCP Editor, Mumbai, India.
Completely PAL.

[Sam Goetz]

WOW! Well, it seems that BM has FINALLY fixed this problem with their new drivers. Specifically the 6.5.1 drivers.

Initial testing on my end resulted in frame accurate layoffs with absolutely no tinkering. Of course this is only after a few tests and who knows if something will pop up in the next couple of days. But for now, I’m very happy.

Thank you BM!

p.s. There still is a terrible HD downconversion bug that came up with the 5.4 drivers that has yet to be fixed. I will be posting about that soon…

[Christopher Tay]

I would also like to add that I’ve experienced frame accurate inserts with the new 6.5.1 driver and FCP 6.0.1 on a PAL DigiBeta VTR. Just straight out of the driver, no meddling with settings at all. I did about 5-6 insert edits at different tape location and they were very accurate.

Will try again today to see if it remains the same.

-chrispy

[Idouglass]

I have had success with this now as well, using the new drivers, after four years of workarounds that were unpleasant, at best, especially in crunch time…The time/money the workarounds have cost me would have paid for 10 new AJA cards. Shame on Blackmagic for taking so long admitting their cards were problematic.