DVCPRO HD running on internal drives

[13]

yes

[Tito Da costa]

You won’t even have to strip them together… I’ve played back DVCPRO HD (720 24P) from a 5400 drive on a laptop with no “hickups”… but if you want to uncompress them to 10 bit uncompressed for final output, you’ll need a RAID that can support 100MB/sec for 720 24P and 130 for 1080.

T
http://www.titodacosta.com

[Shane Ross]

[tito da Costa] “but if you want to uncompress them to 10 bit uncompressed for final output, you’ll need a RAID that can support 100MB/sec for 720 24P and 130 for 1080.”

Uncompressed HD? We are talking 180MB/s to 230MB/s for that.

Shane

Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net

[Walter Biscardi]

[tito da Costa] “but if you want to uncompress them to 10 bit uncompressed for final output, you’ll need a RAID that can support 100MB/sec for 720 24P and 130 for 1080.”

More like 230MB/s plus for that. With cards like the Kona there’s no need to go to uncompressed as you can play the DVCPro HD timeline directly out to a D5 or HDCAM deck.

Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Food Network’s “Good Eats”
HD Editorial for “Assignment Earth”

Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi

[Tito Da costa]

With all due respect,

[walter biscardi] “With cards like the Kona there’s no need to go to uncompressed as you can play the DVCPRO HD timeline directly out to a D5 or HDCAM deck.”

That’s all nice and dandy, but are you going to do your color correction and SFX on DVCPRO HD? Not that you couldn’t, but you’re definitely limiting yourself and the quality of your output (specially with the noisy blacks and red chroma aberration inherent to DVCPRO HD).

[walter biscardi] “More like 230MB/s plus for that”

As far as I know 1280×720 24p 4:2:2 10bit uncompressed uses 100mb/sec and 1920×1080 24p 4:2:2 10bit uncompressed uses 130mb/sec
If you’re talking about performances recommended by vendors… I would be broke if went along with what any of them say and that has never stopped me from getting my job done at the highest possible quality.

Any way the word “uncompressed” gets thrown around here a lot, but truly uncompressed HD takes up to 1GB/sec for 2K and 2GB/sec for 4K, like what you’d get out of aVIPER when David Fincher shot Zodica Killer (imagine the amount of hard drive space at the end of the shoot #”!%/$$$$!”@!).
For us in the real world, “uncompressed” means 4:2:2 10 bit, or if you’re floating on your way to the clouds 4:4:4 at 2:1 compression ratio when you’re mastering on SR (or if you have a cool producer that listens to you and lets you have some new toys for you to play with!-))

The point of all this is, if you’re working with DVCPRO HD, you should pretty much look at it like you’re working on MiniDV (you’re working with native codecs. Why doesn’t Sony release their codecs, so we could work on HDCAM the same way!?!? Well at 50 mb/sec, but that’s still better then 130…).

Mini DV:
If your output specs are not demanding, you’re looking at 3.3 mb/sec all the way, but if you’re looking for a critical quality output (like if you’re going to do an HD blow up, or film out) you should capture your footage at 4:2:2 10 bit uncompressed, so you can have the codec unwrapped before you get it inside your computer, in order to get all that MiniDv has to offer and to get all the latitude you need for color correction. This should all be done in the digital world without any analog conversions, off course.

DVCPRO HD:
You’re looking at 8 mb/sec (depending on the flavor of DVCPRO HD) but once again if you need to get a high quality output, like I mentioned with MiniDV, you’re looking at 100 mb/sec for 1280×720 24p 4:2:2 10 bit uncompressed.

You can playback 100 mb/sec files from 4 sata drives striped together. Will you get occasional drop frames? Yes, you will! But if you have to rent a D5 deck (unless you have $100.000 burning your pocket) to output it anyway, why not go with your finished files to a post house that will do that for less then what your rental would have cost?

T
http://www.titodacosta.com

[Gary Adcock]

[Tito da Costa] “That’s all nice and dandy, but are you going to do your color correction and SFX on DVCPRO HD? Not that you couldn’t, but you’re definitely limiting yourself and the quality of your output”

Remember that not everyone on this list has the same needs or requirements as everyone else.

“Any way the word “uncompressed” gets thrown around here a lot, but truly uncompressed HD takes up to 1GB/sec for 2K and 2GB/sec for 4K,”
Not really the raw HDSDI baseband signal is 1.5GBps or 50% larger than you quote. 4K files can be as large as 24MB per frame but the average thruput is well over 325 MBps to playback 2K DPX files in realtime. you can guess what uncompressed 4K will be.

“DVCPRO HD: once again if you need to get a high quality output, , you’re looking at 100 mb/sec for 1280×720 24p 4:2:2 10 bit uncompressed.”

Once again your math is a little peculiar 720p24 @ 8bit is only about 45MBps, the 720p60 @ 8bit is about 100MBps.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows

[Tito Da costa]

Thank you for correcting me on my “math”!-)

My point was only to help out with the original question, but also to clarify the person in question, that is about to acquire a new system, that internal hard drives are more then enough to work with DVCPRO HD in its native form, but that he should take in consideration how he might want to finish his final product.

Cheers!)

T
http://www.titodacosta.com

[Jeremy Garchow]

As long as you pair the two 500 Gigs together, you can stripe them. If you try and strip 250 and a 500, the 500 Gig drive’s capacity would go down to 250 Gigs, you can’t make a 750 Gig raid from a 250 and a 500.

I recommend getting external storage, but if you are looking to save a buck, you will be able to easily edit 720p24 footage on a two drive raid 0 stripe.

Jeremy

[Gary Adcock]

[Tito da Costa] ” but also to clarify the person in question, that is about to acquire a new system, that internal hard drives are more then enough to work with DVCPRO HD in its native form, but that he should take in consideration how he might want to finish his final product.”

Very, Very true Tito.

I am also one of those that swears by and only uses hardware redundancy on my edit stations, having lived thru the nightmare of failing FW drives. While I think that SATA is a wonderful idea the lack of redundancy makes me just as nervous as it did with FW.

Wait til everyone gets to see infiniband at work.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows