Converting 25fps to 24fps film

[Heather Mahoney]

Hi Dave,
Yes, I mean 23.98, I’m in the US. I also forgot to mention the footage is SD and the delivery medium will be NTSC DVD that I would like to be 24p. The footage will also be archived on a NTSC DigiBeta tape.

The film is an old Russian war film captured at 25fps PAL that originally was designed to be shown at 24fps. I would like to be able to work with a 24 (23.98) fps project. Thank you for your help.
~Heather

[Bouke Vahl]

I’ve done this a lot. (For commercial titles)
Use AE or Cinematools to convert the framerate.
I did it with AE, as you also need to downscale from 720×576 to 720×480.
In AE, import your assets, set the framerate of the clips as if they are 23.976 (NOT 23.98), and drop them in a 23.976 timeline.
Apply scale to your liking. (you must at least scale vertical to get into the 480 range).
Render to a new clip.
For audio, you need to change the sample rate.
Set the new sample rate to 46034 if you started with 48000
(QTchange can do this for you, but other packages as well.)
This will involve a pitch shift, but that is good for two reasons.
First, you don’t have to worry about quality, as it stays the same.
Second, changes are very big the audio was sped up during the transfer, so you end up with the original pitch.

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros

[Neil Sadwelkar]

If your original PAL tape was a 4% fast transfer from a 24fps original, then you can conform all your 25fps captures to 24fps with Cinema Tools. This is near instantaneous and changes the playback speed by 4%. Duration is affected, of course, but the number of frames remains the same.

This method of 25 conformed to 24 fps forms the basis of all film editing in PAL countries.
23.976 fps is a valid 24 fps for NTSC workflows. If you need ‘true 24fps’ then conform in Cinema Tools is the only method.

About the 24@25 setting, that has been provided to enable FCP to track the original 25fps time code in clips conformed to 24fps. So that you can have originals at 25fps (like from a telecine), edit at 24 fps, and then make a correct EDL at the source 25fps.

———————————–
Neil Sadwelkar
neilsadwelkar.blogspot.com
twitter: fcpguru
FCP Editor, Edit systems consultant
Mumbai India

[Neil Sadwelkar]

Bouke,

Looks like we both replied at the exact same time.

———————————–
Neil Sadwelkar
neilsadwelkar.blogspot.com
twitter: fcpguru
FCP Editor, Edit systems consultant
Mumbai India

[Heather Mahoney]

Thank you for your help everyone. I have been able to successfully create a 23.98 NTSC file that is about 4 percent longer than the original PAL version using Cinema Tools. The final thing I need help on is adjusting the pitch of the audio. When I stretched the audio in Final Cut to match the new NTSC version the audio sounds a bit too low compared to the original PAL version. Should I be using Soundtrack Pro, which I am very new at, to fix the pitch? Is there an automatic pitch adjustment control that will adjust the pitch when I stretch out the audio? Thanks in advance.
~Heather

[Bouke Vahl]

This is going to be your decision.
My bet is the new audio is good, as probably the original audio is speeded up like the video.
One way to be sure is to find some music in the score, and ask a good musician with absolute hearing to tell if it is right.
(Or any sound that can be tracked to it’s original)

Or, put a bit online somewhere and let the crowd judge.
(you know, crowds are right most of the time, but make it a double blind test)

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros

[Michael Gissing]

Good pitch correction is not trivial. The best tools in my experience are MPEX3, Pitch & Time or iZotope2.

Either find a facility with one of those or buy iZotope2.

[Bouke Vahl]

Good pitch correction is to leave it as it is if it is good to start with.
(and that was my intention of my post…)

Why is everyone around here making things more difficult than what it is?

This is a forum about editing. Most of the important things about editing is NOT to change ANYTHING if you ain’t got the time / budget / knowledge to make it better. Just cut in the essentials and be done with it.

(a bit of a short version of my way of seeing things.)

(and yes, i’ve got 25 years of experience in this bizz, and no, i’m not after a flame war…)

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros

[Michael Gissing]

[Bouke Vahl] “Good pitch correction is to leave it as it is if it is good to start with.
(and that was my intention of my post…)
“

At no stage has it been made clear what the original frame rate of the film was. If it was 25 and telecined @ 25 then changing the speed to 24 will require a pitch conversion. If the original was 24 then no pitch correction is required.

The fact that Heather feels there is a pitch problem and has asked for advice on pitch correction, I feel offering her the best advice to be something other than a complication. STP is not in the same league as the other software I mentioned.

[Bouke Vahl]

[Michael Gissing] “At no stage has it been made clear what the original frame rate of the film was”

Well, as the OP told in the thread:
(note to you, read thread before making smart remarks)

[Heather Mahoney] “The film is an old Russian war film captured at 25fps PAL that originally was designed to be shown at 24fps”

Now i’m signing off, i did my best.

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pros