Color correction workflow dispair

[David Roth weiss]

[Guillaue Chadaillac] “I am working an a macbook pro and I am 100% sure that is calibrated properly. I used colorsync in advanced mode and I am a geek.”

It sure doesn’t sound like it’s calibrated properly.

From what you’ve written, you’ve only got two possibilities for introducing bad color:

1) your monitor isn’t properly calibrated and so you’ve color corrected to an improper baseline

2) Sorenson Squeeze is completely trashing otherwise good color

I’d have to think that the problem is the former, not the latter.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
https://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

A forum host of Creative COW’s Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.

[Guillaume Chadaillac]

Really?

With all due respect, calibrating thw screen is not that hard… that s 5 apples that have to fit in terms of luniance and color into 5 squares… I am no superman. But I ve done it many times and always land in the same ball park…

Calibration problems aside, the Internet is SWARMED with people complaining about inconsistency between FCP canvas, quicktime and h264.
If I open the same apple prores file in fCP, quicktime and squeeze and put them side by side, it is just not the same.

Can you please give a second thought?
Or maybe someone who had the same problem chime in?

[David Roth weiss]

[Guillaue Chadaillac] “the Internet is SWARMED with people complaining about inconsistency between FCP canvas, quicktime and h264.”

I actually have no flipping idea whatsoever exactly what Apple’s calibration is designed to achieve, or for which apps it was designed for, but I do know having tried it out many times that it isn’t close to the proper calibration that insures a proper baseline necessary for the proper color grading of video.

Since you haven’t been specific about your precise color problem(s), nor provided a sample, it’s hard to know what issues you’re having. So, I’d suggest that you post both a before and after still from your video so we here can properly provide the help you seek.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
https://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™

A forum host of Creative COW’s Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.

[Shane Ross]

You need a broadcast monitor…to see what it REALLY looks like. And then anything bad that happens to that color, is the fault of whatever software compression you are doing. Your job is to make it look as good as it can. Once you do that, you’re done.

If the compression messes up the color, then you need to talk to Sorenson and ask them, “why the hell are you messing with my color?” They will come back with “Well, to compress as much as we do to make it small as it is, we need to toss out some color information.”

And that is a fact. Compression tosses out video information, so that it can make small file sizes. YOu will not get the same colors you see in FCP…sorry.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[James Mortner]

Hello there,

Just to check, is RGB rendering enabled on your FCP sequence settings ? Do you get the same result rendering an mp4 from compressor or mpeg streamclip ?

[Guillaume Chadaillac]

Thanks for the prompt reponse.

This being said. Is there (today in 2011) a product that will allow me to connect my laptop to a broadcast monitor?

Additional question: My product will ONLY be broadcasted on the internet, does it change the way to approach video and color correction in anyway?

[Cameron Clendaniel]

Matrox has products that will allow you to connect your laptop to a broadcast monitor (a search on this forum will surely turn up lots of options).

And even if your final deliverable is only going on the internet, correcting your colors using a properly calibrated broadcast monitor at least gives you a baseline to work off of. The reality is that pretty much everyone’s computer monitor is going to display your colors differently – so you do the best you can.

A more immediate approach: do some trial and error tests on short clips, correcting in FCP and seeing how they look as H264 compressions. If you’re finding that the colors in your H264 compressions are not satisfactory, then make the necessary adjustments in FCP according to how they’ll look in the final H264. Not ideal but you should be able to develop a sense of how the adjustments need to be made.

Cameron Clendaniel
film editor, NYC
http://www.camclendaniel.com

[Shane Ross]

[Guillaue Chadaillac] ” Is there (today in 2011) a product that will allow me to connect my laptop to a broadcast monitor?”

OH my yes.

https://www.aja.com
https://www.decklink.com
https://www.matrox.com/video/en/home
https://www.motu.com

[Guillaue Chadaillac] ” My product will ONLY be broadcasted on the internet, does it change the way to approach video and color correction in anyway?”

Well, you are working with video. And you want the video to look the best it can…the way it is SUPPOSED to look. Then you color correct to a broadcast monitor…or at least a decent HDTV. What the web compression does to it, or how people have their monitors set up to display video is out of your hands. Just make the best product you can. Calibrating COMPUTER monitors really only works for PRINT work, not video. That’s why the need for the capture card/HDTV/Broadcast monitor.

Can you do without it? Yes. But how can you know that what you are doing using your computer monitor is right? Because the Canvas isn’t designed to show you a full quality color accurate image. Nor is the COLOR image viewer.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[Rich Rubasch]

I think most of the replies missed the point. It’s not so much what monitor he is using but how the same video looks different from FCP to H264. I blame Squeeze.

Try doing a simple encode to H264 using Quicktime or compressor and compare it to the Squeeze output. My guess is you will find which software does a better job of matching the source in FCP.

BTW, like you, I have been able to calibrate my desktop computer monitors and laptop monitors to very nearly match our broadcast monitors within a very small margin of error. I have had other editors comment how they have never seen the computer match the broadcast monitor so closely, but we work at it. I think it is Squeeze causing the issue.

Rich Rubasch
Tilt Media Inc.
Video Production, Post, Studio Sound Stage
Founder/President/Editor/Designer/Animator
https://www.tiltmedia.com

[Dustin Parsons]

I’m not sure a broadcast monitor would solve your problem – if you’re viewing your video in Final Cut as well as Quicktime (H.264 from Sorenson) and your website all on the same monitor and they’re all showing different colors, then the differences have nothing to do with your monitor and everything to do with the programs your viewing it in. If you hooked up a broadcast monitor and viewed the video in the same 3 programs you’d run into the same problem – the broadcast monitor doesn’t override Final Cut/Quicktime/Firefox’s handing of colors so they would all still appear different.

In addition, if your videos are going to live on the web alone and only be viewed online by someone with a computer monitor, why calibrate for/with a device no one will watch it on?

In your Quicktime preferences if you check ‘Enable Final Cut Studio Compatibility’ then Quicktime will display your video with the same colors as Final Cut. This does not actually change your video at all, just how Quicktime on your machine displays it’s colors – so it’ll still appear the same way in your web browser and really doesn’t solve anything.

It’s a headache, I’ve never been able to get an H.264 to not shift the gamma and colors from the original. You might check out X.264, it appears to be able to do just that. However, I wouldn’t suggest using it for any professional work as I’ve found it has a lot of bugs.