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Auto Facial Focus vs Manual?
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Hi Todd,
What do you think of these monitors? They are in my price range and appear to meet the specs you suggested? or am I wrong and just being hopeful that I can find a monitor around this price range?
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/854001-REG/Delvcam_delv_dslr_7l_Camera_Top_7_HDMI_LCD.html
i’d like to send you a piece of New Zealand to thank you for your commitment to helping me out – how can i do that?
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Hey Pat thanks for the link I will give the manual a look when I get an opp…
As for the monitors, I didn’t see any of those three that I’d consider ideal. The problem is so many of those little TTF monitors say they are HD when they really aren’t… they’ll only take in an HD signal, but they are only actually displaying more or less standard-def resolution. Click on the “specs” tab for each of those and you’ll see that the vertical resolution on the first two is only 480 lines. Now the third one is a little better but it has the benefit of pixel-to-pixel mode. That means if you push a button on it the picture blows up to actual HD size, and you see the center of the screen but at full resolution. I don’t know what your physical capabilities or limitations are, but if that’s something you can handle that monitor could be very workable for focusing. Another problem with small TTF monitors is that very few even exist in full 1080 resolution, period. The most you can usually find in the little (7-inch or so) ones is 720… but that’s a whole lot better than those “pretenders” that only show 480 lines.
As for zebras, if you see zebra stripes you’ll only be overexposing if your stripes are set to 100%. If they are set to, say, 65 or 70 percent, then the moment you start seeing a hint of stripes on a subject’s forehead or nose then your exposure is pretty good. I don’t know if that particular camera model has setable zebras or not… the manual should tell you, and how to set them if so.
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
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Read your manual for how to set two different type/settings for zebra patterns. Zebra’s are nothing more or less than a built in light meter, which show you where in the image that range of light is present. 100 IRE shows in areas that are 100 IRE or higher and is considered blown out or overexposed. You try to limit this as much as possible. They’ll be no visual detail left in these spots and you can’t recover the details in post. So 100 IRE would be your zebra 2 setting. I would check that once after setting up your interview, make any corrections and then turn that kind of zebra off. That is assuming a non-moving shot.
The most important thing for an interview is the human face. On Caucasian skin you want about 70-80 IRE. So set your camera’s #1 Zebra at 70-80 and it will show you the range around that setting. It’s a ballpark. Once you become experienced with the camera and if you are using a proper monitor what you see is what you get. But it does help you set your basic settings that effect exposure including F-stop, gain, filters etc. But you want some modeling of the face – that is light and dark areas which gives the face some dimension, some character, some 3D qualities. So you want the brightest part of the face to fall say between 75-85 IRE and other parts to have some shadowing. Use the zebra setting 70-75 as a guide-you want to see just a little stripes on the face but not more. Then use your eyes and with time – experience.
Remember these are ballparks and there are many variables including how the image chip of the cam deals with those light levels. Like I said above, set your zebra at say 75 and then play with your exposure control – have the zebras appear and vanish on your subject’s face to get the feel for the range and image you want. You certainly want nothing appearing overexposed.
When I use a consumer level cam that has a zebra preset at 80 IRE – I make the zebra stripes just start to appear on a human face and then back off one exposure notch and leave just a hint of stripes on the highlights. With better cams and a monitor I play with several settings to get the best image.
Let’s say you are outdoors and in order to not overexpose the face you need to stop down to a higher F-stop. Well this closes down your aperture and increases your depth of field. Depending on the lens and camera you most likely want your lens at the lowest or second lowest F-stop so the lens is wide open and focuses sharply on your subject’s face. You might want to use a built in filter (ND Filter), then open up your aperture.
You can’t beat a good monitor attached to your camera to learn what these controls and your lighting set-up does to your image. Yeah there is vocabulary and reading your cam’s manual and reading about common practices – but every situation is different and in the end you are capturing an image on a TV screen. If you think it looks good and you have good taste then use those settings. There is no one right way or perfect setting.
Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.
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Ok Patrick I’ve glanced through the manual, it looks like a pretty full-featured camera.
I’ll backtrack a little bit on some of my “always go all manual” preaching. If the auto-face detection (page 50) works well, then it might be something you’d want to leave on. You’ll just have to play with it and test it to see how it works.
Your flip out finder might be good enough after all. I didn’t realize this camera has “peaking” and “magnification” focus assist tools (pages 48 and 49). I have both of these on my C300PL and they actually do work VERY well, especially the peaking feature. Check to see if these are good enough and workable tools for you, if so you might get away with not having to invest in an expensive monitor (although having a monitor is really nice, and I still highly recommend having one).
One of your problems with the noise has been the gain has been getting too high when shooting in full auto. That means that unbeknownst to you your gain might be creeping up as high as 24 dB… that’s REALLY high and no doubt would give you pretty grainy/noisy video. The good news though is that even in auto modes you can “throttle” the gain so that it doesn’t go any higher than some pre-determined setting that you assign. Learn about the “Automatic Gain Control” on page 53. It will bear some testing, you’ll probably find that you never want it to go above +6 or so to keep the picture noise free.
You’re going to want to make sure the shutter speed isn’t affected in an effort to adjust for exposure. Do this by keeping the shutter speed setting to “off” (page 53) and that will lock the shutter at a “normal” speed.
If you do auto exposure, you’ll want to do this with auto iris ONLY. See page 57 on how to set this.
You’ll normally want your light metering set to “standard” for regular day-to-day work, but with your well-lit talent on your black limbo background you might find that the “spot” setting gives you better results (page 58).
After you get those things all set, you might still find that your exposure is consistently too bright or too dark. If that’s the case, you can use the “AE Shift Control” (also page 58) to adjust +/- and “cheat” the exposure either up or down a bit to get it exactly as you like.
This might seem complicated but once you are really familiar with all these features and what they do (and why) I think it will be much easier and eventually become second nature.
Again, I almost can’t believe I’d ever advise someone to use anything other than full manual everything, but you have some special circumstances all the way around… everything from your physical capabilities to your somewhat-difficult talent/lighting situation to even the shear length of your interviews… so in this case I think some of the auto features could be helpful. Remember I said SOME. Learn what those various features and settings can do and resist the urge to ever go “full auto”… and I think you’ll come up with something you will be happy with.
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
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[Todd Terry] “If you do auto exposure, you’ll want to do this with auto iris ONLY. See page 57 on how to set this.
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It depends on the shot. The wider the shot the more auto iris might be a problem. If the back ground is bright then your faces will be under exposed. Maybe if you are using the black b.g. and your subject is moving and you widen to a mid shot it would work well.
[Todd Terry] “Your flip out finder might be good enough after all. I didn’t realize this camera has “peaking” and “magnification” focus assist tools (pages 48 and 49). I have both of these on my C300PL and they actually do work VERY well, especially the peaking feature.”
I have used these features on cams closer to the price point of the XF100 and both are helpful though the better the lens, the better the monitor, the better the scene is lit, the better all that works. I also think that with a better lens you have more play in terms of bringing up levels in post. With smaller cams I think you need to be as concerned with under exposure as over exposure.
If you are using an external monitor than having these features turned on is great because they will only appear on the LCD of the cam and you still have the external monitor to judge your composition. Same with zebra stripes.
Also if you are going to use an auto focus feature, learn how that feature works on your cam. It is often set in the cross hairs in the middle of your lens. This is not where you want to place your subject’s eyes. Though on a moving wide shot it can be very helpful.
Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.
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Cheers Craig,
More helpful advice!
I’ve just been playing around with the peaking and magnification and peaking functions – very helpful. To me Peaking 1 looks good.
I’m still digesting what Todd has written down but I’ll a lot more questions I’m sure. I appreciate your help.
From yours and Todd’s advice I believe that purchasing an external monitor will help to the long run. I think a long articulating arm the attaches to the camera would work o.k. for me. If I sit next to the camera then I can monitor all the levels on the LCD screen and keep an eye on the monitor.
Craig, can you recommend an external monitor? It’s proving hard to find one within my budget.
Thanks again.
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Todd,
Man have you given me some exercise with all your recommendations. I’m going over all your advice/instructions and have got to the point today where I’m about to call it a night.
But from what instructions I’ve acted on I went through with the person helping me out and we’ve both got the manual focus sorted and the magnification function does help.
So with an interview with a darkened room, lights and the black screen I’ve set the camera to:
Focus: Manual Focus worked Peaking 1
Light Metering: Spot Light
Gain: 0I will digest everything you’ve written down for me over the next day and keeping familiarising myself with these functions. I’m sure I’ll have more questions though. I think it’s a good idea to read more about how all these functions work on cameras in general.
An external monitor would be nice. One that fits onto the camera with an articulating arm would be great for it will allow me to watch all the notifications on the LCD and the other things on the monitor. If I want the best picture then a few extra tools won’t hurt but can you suggest one for it’s been hard finding the right one for the right price.
Will be in touch once I’ve tried all your tricks.
Thanks again
Pat
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Well the Flanders I mentioned earlier is a great monitor that you can use in the field and in post. It can be set up on its own stand and gives your a large monitor that can be seen at a distance so it doesn’t get in your way though you do need to be connected to it. SDI cable is the best for this though I don’t know if your cam has SDI out.
The panasonic plasma is a professional monitor but not considered a broadcast monitor. It is used by many companies to show their clients. Either one will let you learn what your cam is doing. I suppose there are cheaper monitors but many consumer sets are not calibrated correctly and do not always have the controls to do so. You do not want a monitor that makes the image look brighter than it is or boosts the sharpness etc. If you are happy with the image you are getting with your cam and the focus assist features allow you to get a sharp focus then hold off until you can afford a decent monitor. But in my experience having that monitor near your cam in the studio is a great learning tool and improves your lighting and overall production. You are seeing what you are getting and allows you to use all the features like focus assist. With out the extra monitor then the LCD screen can get crowded with all the overlays. When you are setting up lights you can turn the external monitor toward the person arranging the lights so they see what effect they are having.
I have not seen a cheaper one that was worth much but there is a lot of new gear coming out all the time.
The advantage of a broadcast monitor is you can also use it to color correct and adjust exposure in post.
If you are near a professional video store you might bring in your cam and ask to try out some monitors. Connect your cam and see if your LCD screen is giving you an accurate exposure level and focus. Many consumer level LCD screens are made too bright to allow for easier framing and to be seen more easily in daylight. Try to match its image with a true monitor. It most likely has a brightness control.
I would certainly buy good lights and mikes before a monitor but I really think it would up your game. Wish I knew of one in the $300 range but I haven’t seen one. The marshall stuff is good for video mixers where the TD needs to see what is on each of the four cams. Even there our mixer puts them all on one monitor and we use a panasonic.
If you can’t afford it now just experiment with the variables that Todd suggested and it will improve your image. One thing that will help him or anyone here help you is post a screen grab of your lighted interview or even a short clip of it. You’ll get good advice how to light it better.
Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.
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Hi Todd and Craig,
I”ve attached an image of the interview in question that started this conversation. Now it’s over exposed and noisy. I’m using a Falcon Fluro https://www.falconeyes.com.hk/Product.aspx?id=857 as the fill light and a small head light with soft box.
From here I need to use the soft box diffuser on the light. It’s a grunty light and I only need one or two lights on. This interview only had one on.
This interview was recorded with full manual with auto facial focus.
I’ve got my camera set to all of the specs you both have advised.
Manual Focus: Using the magnification with Peaking 1. Zooming into the eye and foucueing on that then zooming back to the desired frame.
Gain is set to zero.
Lighting metering: Spot Light
Shutter Speed setting is off.
Zebra is set for 75%
And been using manual iris control.I’m going to break the bank and get a monitor if I can Out of these two which would work:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/896283-REG/ikan_d5_5_6_3G_SDI_Camera_Monitor.html
If there is anything you can advise me on regarding anything to do with the look, framing lighting please hit me with them! I have another interview this Friday where I’ll be using the same
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Obviously it is overexposed, but you know that and are learning how to take care of that issue…
Otherwise…
Framing is fine, I don’t have any issues with that.
Now, lighting is not math so there are no true right or wrong answers… BUT… that setup is not what most people would probably consider optimal…
You have your key light on what most people would consider the “wrong” side. It’s on the left side of the talent (right side of the screen). Usually you’d want to put that on the other side… the direction that the talent is looking.
I think your fill light is also way too hot for my taste. A fill is just, well, to fill a little. The goal of it is not to make the fill side as hot as the key side. You want some difference in it, otherwise the image is very flat. You might try it with no fill instrument at all and see what it looks like… maybe just bounce in a little fill with a white card rather than using an actual instrument. If you do need an instrument, either scrim it down, dim it down, or back it off. I personally don’t like a lot of fill, I like talent very uneven which I think is more interesting. I’ll freely admit that I personally take that farther than is some people’s taste, but yours is very flat, even by other folks’ standards.
I notice this guy is wearing glasses, which can frequently cause reflection issues (although they aren’t too bad with that guy). I’m betting though that if these are older war veterans you are shooting that a lot of them will be wearing glasses so you might run into this issue over and over. If you raise the key up higher (so that it is shooting down on the talent a bit) you can often eliminate those completely, or at least lessen them.
Keep a-shootin’….
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
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