Apple looking to fix UI in FCPX?

[Jon Chappell]

Why do people care so much whether FCPX has tracks or not? I think Apple has made its position clear on this. If you want tracks, use an NLE that has them. That’s what I do.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools – Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools – Edit QuickTime chapters and metdata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools…

[David Lawrence]

[Bill Davis] “There’s this established phenomenon called “projection” where our personal prejudices color how we think about and describe things. In this case, it’s arguable that when David used the term “fix” in his original post, it was nothing more than this factor at work.”

I was simply riffing on the title of Andy Field’s thread immediately below this one. So who’s the one projecting?

_______________________
David Lawrence
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[Charlie Austin]

[Jon Chappell] “Why do people care so much whether FCPX has tracks or not? I think Apple has made its position clear on this. If you want tracks, use an NLE that has them. That’s what I do.”

Exactly. If you want tracks use one of… uh, every other NLE that has ’em. The end.

P.S. Fixed tracks suck. 😉

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[Oliver Peters]

Because….. There are aspects of editing in X where having tracks would be a help, like audio mixing. Some optional track mode (not necessarily universal) would be a valuable feature.

– Oliver

Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com

[Charlie Austin]

[Oliver Peters] “Because….. There are aspects of editing in X where having tracks would be a help, like audio mixing. Some optional track mode (not necessarily universal) would be a valuable feature.”

Mixing is one place where X could benefit from… not tracks, but more robust implementation of roles. Roles effectively are tracks in the organizational sense. The problem is, you can’t organize them yet.

What I hope for is the ability to, firstly, group roles. That’s the biggie. Then, maybe the ability to “collect” groups into subgroups, something like compound clips, which could then be “mixed” overall. Of course you can do this with CC’s and key framing already, but you can’t get into them to edit the contents without opening them in their own timeline, thus losing visual and TC reference to the parent sequence, or breaking them apart, thus losing your overall mix. (there’s a workaround to this last one, but it’s a PITA)

My perfect world would consist of just a couple more selection choices in the Roles timeline index panel.
Next to each role would be Y/N checkboxes for “Group”, “Collect” (or something… Mix Buss?), and “Hide”.

So you could firstly Group all your Roles in the timeline. When you’re ready to mix, Collect all your individual grouped roles (FX, MX, DIA, SUB FX… whatever you’ve specified) into individual “containers” which could then be mixed. But you could still see, and edit in the timeline, all the individual clips. And if you had a complicated timeline, you could Hide specific Roles or something, so that all you’d see are the clips you need to be working on.

These aren’t groundbreaking, other NLE’s can “hide” tracks, and assign multiple tracks to master busses or faders or mix groups. The cool thing would be to be able assign 20+ fx “tracks” to a master fader with one click without having to look to see what tracks were what, or do any assigning or patching… Click. Done.

There are some really interesting possibilities one can envision for Roles, and I hope Apple keeps going with them.My fear is that they will try to implement “tracks” to appease people, and f*ck everything up. Persistent I/O points area an example of that. “Everyone” wanted them, and Apple gave people what they wanted. And made a mess of the key wording/favoriting process. I’m sure they’ll fix it, but it didn’t need to be broken…

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[Jim Giberti]

[Charlie Austin] “Mixing is one place where X could benefit from… not tracks, but more robust implementation of roles. Roles effectively are tracks in the organizational sense. The problem is, you can’t organize them yet. “

Or actual tracks themselves because they’re a pretty neat way to mix audio now, yesterday and tomorrow.

A lot of us don’t need to utilize Roles for much of what we do, but a common sense, industry standard, audio mixing environment would be a great professional enhancement.

Cause it’s simple, logical, and it would work much better than the current implementation.

[Charlie Austin]

[Jim Giberti] “Or actual tracks themselves because they’re a pretty neat way to mix audio now, yesterday and tomorrow.

Grouping roles, and assigning that group to a recordable/automated mix buss/master fader would accomplish the exact same thing IMHO, And with much less patching, or none at all.

[Jim Giberti] A lot of us don’t need to utilize Roles for much of what we do, but a common sense, industry standard, audio mixing environment would be a great professional enhancement.

Cause it’s simple, logical, and it would work much better than the current implementation.”

I totally agree that tracks are better than “the current implementation” of roles. 🙂 But the possibilities that dynamic, clip-based roles open up are way more powerful than fixed tracks. Again, IMHO.

I think I have a little cred for this opinion, having worked in recording studios since the 80’s, and having been a post mixer (spots, trailers, and the odd indie feature) for about 5-6 years before I magically became an editor. So… I’m not unfamiliar with industry standard, audio mixing environments. 😉

Speaking of potential, I found this interesting…

https://www.thedawstudio.com/News/Logic_10_Leak.html

The plot thickens…

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[David Lawrence]

[Charlie Austin] “Speaking of potential, I found this interesting… “

Funny how it still seems to use fixed tracks, even though they suck. :p

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl

[Jim Giberti]

[Charlie Austin] “I think I have a little cred for this opinion, having worked in recording studios since the 80’s, and having been a post mixer (spots, trailers, and the odd indie feature) for about 5-6 years before I magically became an editor. So… I’m not unfamiliar with industry standard, audio mixing environments. ;-)”

I’d never doubt your cred Charlie.

In addition to being creative director and president of my firm I’ve been a performing musician, writer, and producer since I was 18. I built and operated some of the first digital recording and video editing facilities in our region and my personal working studio is a combination 48 track digital audio room and FCP editing suite combined. I’m currently producing a series of 45 short films that I’m shooting and scoring over the next two years.

I’d prefer simple audio tracks as an option.

[Charlie Austin]

[Jim Giberti] “In addition to being creative director and president of my firm I’ve been a performing musician, writer, and producer since I was 18. I built and operated some of the first digital recording and video editing facilities in our region and my personal working studio is a combination 48 track digital audio room and FCP editing suite combined. I’m currently producing a series of 45 short films that I’m shooting and scoring over the next two years.

I’d prefer simple audio tracks as an option.”

lol… Fair enough. And I wasn’t doubting your cred either Jim. 🙂 Though I think grouping and assigning roles to a “group master” or something like that would work just as well.

But David’s post brings up an interesting point. On reflection, my glib “tracks suck” opinion is specific to editing picture and sound in an NLE. For me, patching tracks and playing track tetris completely stops the creative process in it’s “tracks” (see what I did there?), and forces you to be a technician. Maybe just for a few seconds at a time, but it adds up. This wasn’t apparent to me until i started really being able to cut quickly in FCP X. But when I work in 7 or re-familiarize myself with MC or learn Pr now, I notice it. A lot. And, also IMO, the greatest trim tools on earth are really just a workaround to clip collisions. For a dedicated DAW, at least in roles’ current implementation, maybe not. We’ll have to see where roles end up.

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~