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Alex 4d on the FCP X development cycle…
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I’m confused, Bill. Shawn very clearly answered your question which was,
[Bill Davis] “Personally, since I don’t edit in Premier,I’d be interested in a list some of what the editorial engine in Premier does today that other NLEs didn’t do 10 or even 5 years back?”[Bill Davis] “My essential point is that none of what you list is UNIQUE to Premier.
While the internal database features, magnetic timeline, Roles and numerous other things that are foundational to X ARE unique to X.”
Ah, I see, you just did a poor job of wording your leading question.
FWIW, the Mercury Playback Engine *is* about PPro. From Adobe, “‘Mercury Playback Engine’ is a name for a large number of performance improvements in Premiere Pro CS5.” (https://forums.adobe.com/message/3377595). You might be confusing the MPE with CUDA (the Nvidia tech that Adobe originally leveraged to power the MPE).
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[Michael Gissing] “Either. OMF is still useful and in many ways more stable. It is my preferred deliverable before I start sound post. Collaborative workflows are still relevant in 2015, just like they were in 2005.”
In what cases does an OMF work out better than an AAF? I want to know what to look out for.
The indie features I’ve had to ‘post supervise’* that were cut in X, AAFs have saved a lot of time in the sound design/mix being able to preserve more of the sound design work the editor performed. Aside from some oddball audio formats that had to be sorted, as long as the roles were set on import XtoPro has worked without issue with a lot less work prepping for the mix.
*(I say this lightly as I come in at the end and deliver the cut to sound and color finishing usually with a lot of having to fix non specific to any NLE workflow issues.)
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[Andrew Kimery] “I’m going to say it’s a mix of confirmation bias, post-purchase rationalization and a warped sense of White Knight Syndrome that compels some people to ride to the rescue of a multi-billion dollar global corporation.
“Perfectly fine pesudo behavioral analysis!
And since thats the game, lets also add in a touch of Stockholm syndrome and consumer level pseudo PTSD.
After all, for more than 2 years, everyone was telling us X editors that we were clueless noobs that didn’t deserve the title of professional editor – so perhaps we all just have very fragile egos and are still overly pissy about it!
Then again, since we’re plumbing the depths of fake psychoanalysis – perhaps there’s a bit of transference happening as well.
Confirmation gets cut more than one bias, after all. It’s possible that a “pro” editors’ thinking can be unnecessarily constrained by their prior NLE preferences – and that they become unwilling to change due to a mixture of a deep desire for comfort and convenience – even when such a change could be personally beneficial?
Lets dub that “crumbling-confirmation rationalization syndrome” for fun.
Oh, and I’m confused. Who’s playing the object of the White Knight scenario? Tim Cook? If EVER there was a person who seems to NOT be in distress – it’s Mr. Cook. And what are we supposed to save him from? Another world record breaking quarter? Please. FCP X also doesn’t need a White Knight for the simple reason that virtually ALL the initial attack memes have proved to be transitory and kinda dumb in retrospect. The early haters got MASSIVE amounts of their analysis almost completely wrong. They mistook a universal change in how software gets created, delivered and refined and tried to parse the new model through the sieve of their experiences with the old model.
The truth is X is great for those who want to look forward. Premier is great for those who want to move forward, but simultaneously deathly afraid to leave ANY of their expertise behind. That’s my personal opinion based on the features in the latest Premier releases that I’ve ready about and has been confirmed by the responses to this thread. I asked about INNOVATIONS in the Premier Editing Approach. And there don’t really appear to be any. Which just says they believe that editing 2005 style is all the market wants or needs.
That and monthly payments forever.
Go figure.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Andrew Kimery] “FWIW, the Mercury Playback Engine *is* about PPro. From Adobe, “‘Mercury Playback Engine’ is a name for a large number of performance improvements in Premiere Pro CS5.” (https://forums.adobe.com/message/3377595). You might be confusing the MPE with CUDA (the Nvidia tech that Adobe originally leveraged to power the MPE).”
Then I stand corrected here.
I didn’t understand that the MPE was exclusively a PPro function.
We’ll score that as a solid point for PPro.
I did some reading and it appears that MPE is less a “thing” than a marketing bucket for CUDA, Open CL, and 64-bit processing. Which now all have equivalent systems in X, Correct? (not taking away that Adobe got there first.)
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Walter Soyka] “f you look at the development and release patterns of nearly any major software, you’ll see a pattern of a large architectural change followed by a series of smaller feature changes (and of course bug fixes).
Operating systems like OS X and iOS are exceptions, because in large part, the feature changes ARE architectural changes.”
Nice post, Walter.
That really helps clarify things.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Bill Davis] “[Shawn Miller] “The Mercury Playback Engine, Warp Stabilizer, support for native file formats (which many FCP editor were against, before FCP had it), masking and tracking, and adjustment layers to name a few. You can decide for yourself if Premiere Pro 2014 can do things that other NLE’s didn’t do a decade ago.”
The Mercury Engine is NOT about Premier. It’s underlying technology.”
Underlying technology of…
I know your original question was about the “editing engine”, but if MPE isn’t about editorial, what is it about? Also, weren’t your questions about the state of Pr 2014 vs Pr 1.5?
[Bill Davis] ” I don’t fully understand the Warp Stabilizer, but if it’s primarily about removing camera shake then X has it’s own version which may or may not be similar.”
Bill, you asked what exists in the Premiere Pro editorial engine that didn’t exist in other NLEs 10 years ago, and what made Premiere Pro 2014 as superior to Premiere Pro 1.5 as FCPX is to FCP Classic… you didn’t say anything about comparing FCPX to Premiere Pro 2014.
[Bill Davis] “My essential point is that none of what you list is UNIQUE to Premier.”
I didn’t say any of those features are unique to Premiere Pro TODAY. I was comparing Premiere Pro 2014 to Premiere Pro 1.5… in response to you original statement and question:
[Bill Davis] “I’d be interested in a list some of what the editorial engine in Premier does today that other NLEs didn’t do 10 or even 5 years back?“
[Bill Davis] “…are there areas where today’s Premier outshines yesterday’s Premier in the same fashion that range tagging, and multi-res background rendering, magnetism and roles have made X a far superior and faster editorial assembly system when compared to FCP Legacy?“
Premiere Pro 2014 is a COMPLETELY different animal from Premiere Pro 1.5; from the Mercury Playback Engine, to masking and tracking, to native file handling, to a host features that would have seemed like magic to any NLE in 2005. And yes, these features make editing in Premiere Pro 2014 a LOT faster than editing in Premiere Pro 1.5.
Shawn
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[Shawn Miller] “Premiere Pro 2014 is a COMPLETELY different animal from Premiere Pro 1.5; from the Mercury Playback Engine, to masking and tracking, to native file handling, to a host features that would have seemed like magic to any NLE in 2005. And yes, these features make editing in Premiere Pro 2014 a LOT faster than editing in Premiere Pro 1.5.
Shawn”
OK,
Fair enough. Thanks for clarifying the yardstick.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Bill Davis] “I did some reading and it appears that MPE is less a “thing” than a marketing bucket for CUDA, Open CL, and 64-bit processing. Which now all have equivalent systems in X, Correct? (not taking away that Adobe got there first.)”
There’s a lot of engineering on top of GPGPU and 64-bit, but forget the technology for a minute.
The Mercury Playback Engine is what lets you do all kinds of effects and compositing in Premiere Pro without rendering. No-transcode and no-render workflows are a huge deal, leading to a very healthy portion of the efficiency improvements you see moving from 7 to X. It’s easy to take them for granted now, but these were pretty forward-looking in 2010.
BTW, markers in Premiere can be longer than a single frame, just like a range, and the latest Premiere release added a databasey feature called “search bins” which I think you would like.
Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive | RenderBreak [blog] | Profile [LinkedIn] -
[Walter Soyka] ”
BTW, markers in Premiere can be longer than a single frame, just like a range, and the latest Premiere release added a databasey feature called “search bins” which I think you would like.”Walter,
I suspect would probably like it many of the attributes of Premier very much but for two things.
I’m making MORE money now with X because I get a lot more done, faster and easier then I did before database driven magnetic editing – plus you know thatI HATE the coercive fishhook rental model with the burning passion of a thousand white hot suns.
I’m pragmatic enough to tolerate it with Lightroom/Photoshop because of the dearth of qualified alternatives. But am devoutly praying almost daily for the deliverance from my rental bondage via Serif.
Where’s Moses when we really need him?
; )
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Walter Soyka] “The Mercury Playback Engine is what lets you do all kinds of effects and compositing in Premiere Pro without rendering. “
Bill, according to Adobe, MPE is basically a system-wide optimization for Premiere Pro. NVIDIA did a lot of marketing around MPE and CUDA leading folks to equate CUDA with MPE, but in reality it’s more than CUDA. It’s a combination of leveraging RAM, the GPU (CUDA, OpenCL and/or software emulation) and the 64-bit architecture. To add to Walter’s comments, the result is that given the identical older Mac Pro tower, you get responsiveness (unrendered,with effects and a variety of codecs) that simply leaves FCP X in the dust on that same machine. Granted, X is tweaked for newer machines, but simple timeline playback of large files in X versus PProCC is a world of difference.
[Walter Soyka] “BTW, markers in Premiere can be longer than a single frame, just like a range, and the latest Premiere release added a databasey feature called “search bins” which I think you would like.”
Furthermore, source clip markers can be labeled and those labels show up in the viewer. So, not only do you see ranges with the picture, but know what those ranges are. No browser view needed.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com
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