Alex 4d on the FCP X development cycle…

[Andrew Kimery]

[Darren Roark] “Editing and playing back 6K Dragon footage without transcoding to a 4K monitor and having it look sharp and stunning demos extremely well. “

Apparently RED footage didn’t demo well enough as native R3D support didn’t get added until 10.0.6. 😉

[Darren Roark] “It’s worth mentioning that Apple doesn’t show up at any trade shows and hold public events for any of their software, not for ten years or so. “

Apple may have stopped official going to things like NAB in 2009-ish but they still had their own road show events as well as user group presentations (revealing X at the LAFCPUG Supermeet during NAB being probably the most high profile example).

[Darren Roark] “Premiere is getting good, but it is still far behind FCP 7 in many ways.”

So is X. 😉

[Jeff Markgraf]

Don’t know about Avid’s GPU support, but I’ve watched the 8.3 demos with 4K footage. Between finally getting AMA to be useful and apparently generating R3D proxies in real time, Avid may finally be getting it’s act together for large frame video. Many of their new features seem to be taking a page from the X playbook. Assuming you have the equipment horsepower, of course.

[Bill Davis]

[Andrew Kimery] “[Darren Roark] “Premiere is getting good, but it is still far behind FCP 7 in many ways.”

So is X. ;)”

Sure Andrew, but the ways in which X is “behind” FCP 7 are largely in the areas that editors who still want to edit like it’s 2005 had come to depend upon.

As a simple cheesy example, I’m not sure how many people who keep up with NLE evolution would trade the magnetic storyline for OMF compatibility.

Personally, since I don’t edit in Premier,I’d be interested in a list some of what the editorial engine in Premier does today that other NLEs didn’t do 10 or even 5 years back? I’m not dismissing Premier’s strengths – among which I acknowledge the suite interchange linkage for After Effects and other similar systemic data transfer modes, but when it comes to cutting content – are there areas where today’s Premier outshines yesterday’s Premier in the same fashion that range tagging, and multi-res background rendering, magnetism and roles have made X a far superior and faster editorial assembly system when compared to FCP Legacy?

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[Shawn Miller]

[Bill Davis] “Personally, since I don’t edit in Premier,I’d be interested in a list some of what the editorial engine in Premier does today that other NLEs didn’t do 10 or even 5 years back?”

The Mercury Playback Engine, Warp Stabilizer, support for native file formats (which many FCP editor were against, before FCP had it), masking and tracking, and adjustment layers to name a few. You can decide for yourself if Premiere Pro 2014 can do things that other NLE’s didn’t do a decade ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Premiere_Pro

Shawn

[Darren Roark]

[Bill Davis] “[Andrew Kimery] “[Darren Roark] “Premiere is getting good, but it is still far behind FCP 7 in many ways.”

So is X. ;)””

I’m in the hated it the first six months, love it now category.

At this point over three and a half years running, what can’t you do in FCP X that you can do in 7 that is actually necessary? Batch export has been a big one which is now possible by the 3rd party dev app called Primaries. Gang sync? I barely ever used it in 7 so I don’t miss it.

I’m including the 3d party apps which have been working great because they can address professional level problems quickly whereas waiting for Adobe or Avid to push out a software update to the all in oneness of their NLEs.

Bill brings up OMF support, when I am asked by post supervisors for them I have to act like google search and say “did you mean AAF?”

[Jeremy Garchow]

[Darren Roark] “Bill brings up OMF support, when I am asked by post supervisors for them I have to act like google search and say “did you mean AAF?””

Yep.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DydGpOCuKt4

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[Michael Gissing]

[Darren Roark] “Bill brings up OMF support, when I am asked by post supervisors for them I have to act like google search and say “did you mean AAF?””

Either. OMF is still useful and in many ways more stable. It is my preferred deliverable before I start sound post. Collaborative workflows are still relevant in 2015, just like they were in 2005.

This thread is specifically talking about how companies like Apple decide what to develop. So it is perfectly instructive to point out what Apple didn’t and hasn’t included in X that are common in other NLEs. If third party developers choose to make an app, they seem to be doing knowing Apple are not intending to just add that as a feature. This is instructive if deciding on which software vendor to hinge your business success.

I wonder why so many are in automatic defense mode whenever a post somehow implies that features that are useful are missing or reliant on third party apps. Why do some editors feel defensive about such valid critique? Just saying it isn’t important any more or that things that X does are so much better that missing features are OK. All NLEs are open to such observation. Nothing wrong with pointing out that for some workflows there are better choices than X. We are not personally criticizing your choice of NLE. Solid and constructive critique makes for improvement for all.

I want X to be better in my area as people want to use it but still struggle with hand over to me for sound & picture post. I am about to start my fourth X job in three & a half years and the editor has been struggling to get the AAF sorted.This is an experienced editor who loves editing with X but hates this stage. Why should it be so?

[Walter Soyka]

I’m not sure that OS X and iOS provide a good reference for understanding the FCP X development cycle.

Operating systems are orders of magnitude more complex than application software. They have a huge number of interrelated sub-systems. They have major security concerns. They run closer to the metal and interface more directly with hardware. Being software that powers other software, they have vastly different QA requirements than application software does.

I blather on about data models here because they are the heart of our application software. You come up with some way to represent a real-world task as data, and you come up with tools to manipulate that data representation. You build these tools as frameworks and use them to implement user-facing functionality in your application.

Within that schema, there are some things that are easy and fast, and other things that are hard and time-consuming. New features that can be built within the existing data model and with the existing frameworks are the former. New features that require changes to the existing data model and frameworks are the latter.

If you look at the development and release patterns of nearly any major software, you’ll see a pattern of a large architectural change followed by a series of smaller feature changes (and of course bug fixes).

Operating systems like OS X and iOS are exceptions, because in large part, the feature changes ARE architectural changes.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]

[Andrew Kimery]

[Michael Gissing] “I wonder why so many are in automatic defense mode whenever a post somehow implies that features that are useful are missing or reliant on third party apps. Why do some editors feel defensive about such valid critique? “

I’m going to say it’s a mix of confirmation bias, post-purchase rationalization and a warped sense of White Knight Syndrome that compels some people to ride to the rescue of a multi-billion dollar global corporation.

What’s absolutely hilarious is apparently I touched a nerve by just copy and pasting the exact words Ron Brinkmann (a former Apple employee) used to describe his time at Apple. I even tried to preemptively avoid feather ruffling by saying this is probably the MO at most big companies and gave Adobe as a specific example, but, hey, some people will always love the Emperor’s new clothes.

[Bill Davis]

[Shawn Miller] “The Mercury Playback Engine, Warp Stabilizer, support for native file formats (which many FCP editor were against, before FCP had it), masking and tracking, and adjustment layers to name a few. You can decide for yourself if Premiere Pro 2014 can do things that other NLE’s didn’t do a decade ago.”

The Mercury Engine is NOT about Premier. It’s underlying technology. If you get that, then I get the entire OS X rewrite including all the Core modules and AV Foundation. I don’t fully understant the Warp Stabilizer, but if it’s primarily about removing camera shake then X has it’s own version which may or may not be similar. As to “native file formats” again, a red herring. X has had them from day one. The number and efficiency of any NLE including that lies on intellectual property issues. Apple has native support for everything Apple has IP rights to via invention, consortium participation, or licensing agreements. EXACTLY as every other NLE. Masking and tracking and adjustment layers are also built into X. You may argue that the implementation is superior in Premier, and that may or may not be true.

My essential point is that none of what you list is UNIQUE to Premier.

While the internal database features, magnetic timeline, Roles and numerous other things that are foundational to X ARE unique to X.

Remember, I’m NOT saying Premier isn’t a fine program. I’m saying that it’s not functionally very much different from all the other NLEs we’ve been using for 20 years.

While FCP X “is” foundational different.

Simple as that.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.