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720p DF Support – Hello Apple?
Ok, I’ve been waiting about two years for this issue to be fixed and I know that Apple reads this forum and they also look at the Feedback forms (which I’ve just sent it) but I also have to vent here. This has been a real issue for our shop since we started editing in 720p / HD. Here’s the issue in a nutshell.
Panasonic Cameras shoot 720 Drop Frame. Panasonic VTR’s record 720 and play back Drop Frame. The Log and Capture Window shows AND Logs 720 Drop Frame.
When we capture clips from the logs, the timecode reverts to Non-Drop Frame with completely wrong TC information. What we get is a completely new Media Start / Stop NDF TC. It’s not even a DF to NDF conversion because we ran a TC Calculator on FCP’s new numbers and they don’t correspond.
Here’s an example.
Shot logged: 08:10:19;25 to 08:10:28;06
Shot captured: 08:09:50:13 to 08:09:58:24Now if you convert the 08:10:19;25 to Non-Drop Frame you get 08:10:04:43. So I really don’t have any idea where FCP is getting 08:09:50:13 as a Media Start TC. FCP was consistent with this new TC on each capture so it’s definitely something FCP is doing.
I have an editor who has been logging for three days and he now has to completely re-log 6 tapes because after capture, all of the TC has reverted to NDF with the completely wrong numbers. We already know we’ll have to re-capture some of this media in the future so we can’t have incorrect TC.
We’re having to cross-convert the entire project to 1080i / 29.97 just to make the TC accurate.
This is absolutely unacceptable that Timecode is being changed by FCP after the logging process. It’s also unacceptable that this issue has not been addressed for over two years now since I brought it to Apple’s attention. They’ve been telling me for two years “it’s coming.” We will never be able to recapture and rebuild this project if we were to stay in 720p.
end of rant. had to vent up here.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Broadcast and independent productions.All Things Apple Podcast! https://cowcast.creativecow.net/all_things_apple/index.html
Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi
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6 Replies
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I will jump on the band wagon with you, Walter.
We finished a small budget feature a few months ago in 720p DF. There was some footage that was shot 1080p that needed to be added. My timecodes changed to NDF also. I spent almost three days working on this issue before I came to the same conclusion. This made working with this a real nightmare, but we trudged through it and made it work.
Hey, APPLE! We are asking for help with this!
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Wayne Carey
Schazam Productions
http://www.schazamproductions.com
https://blogs.creativecow.net/waynecarey -
Why they didn’t have DF support back in 4.5 when they started supporting this format is beyond me. Why they keep making NEW features without fixing the small ones like this is beyond me.
It is just plain stupid. All it does is make me appreciate OTHER edit systems more…and contemplate using THEM instead of FCP.
Shane
Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net -
[Dave LaRonde] “Logging correct time codes is about as fundamental as it gets. In shops where there is enough 720p work, this long-standing defect may be enough to abandon FCP in favor of different editing software.”
The only saving grace are the outstanding people of AJA Video Systems who let me cross-convert the footage to 1080i in real-time so we can use the correct DF timecode.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Broadcast and independent productions.All Things Apple Podcast! https://cowcast.creativecow.net/all_things_apple/index.html
Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi
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Walter, just curious, does the captured footage with wrong numbers match your logged footage? Do you get the pictures you want? If so, have you tried recapturing using the original log numbers and see if FCP converts those to the same wrong numbers? Does it do this consistently? Is the error repeatable?
John
Dual 2.5 G5 4 gigs RAM OS 10.4.8 QT7.1.3
Dual Cinema 23 Radeon 9800
FCP Studio 5 (FCP5.1.2, DVDSP4.1.1, Comp2.3, STP1.1, Motion 2.1.2)
Huge U-320R 1TB Raid 3 firmware ENG15.BIN
ATTO UL4D driver 3.50
AJA IO driver 2.1 firmware v23-28
Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neuman U87s, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN -
[John Fishback] “Walter, just curious, does the captured footage with wrong numbers match your logged footage?”
No.
[John Fishback] “Do you get the pictures you want?”
No.
[John Fishback] “If so, have you tried recapturing using the original log numbers and see if FCP converts those to the same wrong numbers?”
It captures the same exact wrong images.
[John Fishback] “Does it do this consistently? Is the error repeatable?”
Absolutely.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Broadcast and independent productions.All Things Apple Podcast! https://cowcast.creativecow.net/all_things_apple/index.html
Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi
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Ah yes….so in other words…whatever you do whilest logging, DON’T CAPTURE ANYTHING in 720, otherwise your logs will go to that place in the clouds, where In and Out points play harps all day, followed by the sweet melodies of Reel numbers floating around.
Ahhh…tape #6’s logs are there now…..I can almost hear them singing……*sniff*
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