5D workflow in FCP

[Shane Ross]

[Jason Brown] “is there a way to sync time code?”

On a STILL camera? No. This camera does not have professional video inputs/outputs. Not designed for them. The camera doesn’t even record any sort of timecode. Starts from 00:00:00:00. Slating would be your best bet.

[Jason Brown] “We were talking about running an old school TC generator into the audio input and recording LTC…has anyone done this?”

Again, won’t work with this camera. Do you have one? Can you see any inputs for that? Audio inputs? It doesn’t have those.

[Jason Brown] ” I’ll be using Cinema Tools to convert the frame rate from 30 to 29.97.”

Uh, you’d better be using COMPRESSOR to do that…and converting the footage to PRORES at the same time. H.264 isn’t very editable in FCP. Convert to ProRes, and 29.97 timecode in one pass.

So you are trying to do a professional multicamera shoot, designed for studio cameras…with still cameras that have the ability to shoot movies? I think that is unwise.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[Michael Gissing]

Changing from 30 to 29.97 is .1% . Don’t forget to slow the audio down as well before syncing to the prores files. Avoid wav files (particularly broadcast wavs) as FCP seems to be making a mess with them right now.

Make vari speed aifs @ 47.952Khz. Pitch is insignificant at .1%

[Bouke Vahl]

Jason,
Not sure about the 5D, but i know about audio timecode.
You need this:
https://www.videotoolshed.com/?page=products&pID=26

If you have a TC generator, use it.
But you can also use this:
https://www.videotoolshed.com/?page=products&pID=38

No idea what will happen with slowing down in what stage.
But if you use the merge app. that comes with the FCP auxTC reader,
you start with synced clips.

I would like a few Canon clips to toy around though, so if someone can provide me a few, i would be grateful.

hth,

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pro’s

[Rafael Amador]

[Jason Brown] “Also, I’ll be using Cinema Tools to convert the frame rate from 30 to 29.97. Does the conversion from 30 to 29.97 in Cinema Tools change the clip at all? Does it speed it up by .03% ? is it noticeable? “
Jason
You can not “Conform” GOPs based stuff (H264, GOPs MPEG-2,..).
You need to transcode first to any Intraframe format.
So, transcode to Prores (keeping the p30 time-base), then conform to 29’98 in CinemaTools.
The speed difference is absolutely unnoticeable.
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com

[Jason Brown]

Shane…I share your concern, but I’ve shot some footage already with this…I love the look, and YES the 5D does have an audio input, albeit a mini plug…but you CAN record audio…(not balanced) but I’m wanting to record LTC in that audio track. Curious if any of you editors have run across this and used it successfully. I intend on doing extensive testing, as this is a rather large shoot…but I feel very comfortable about everything else other than the syncing of time code. There are SEVERAL people that I’ve talked to that are using this camera in conjunction with RED cameras and for very large shoots.

As I’m typing this…I’m wondering if I can make multicam clips like in the avid based on the slate clap…and just cut one main edit…then switch to the other cam like I can in AVID. Maybe that’s a better way to go.

-Jason

[Jason Brown]

Hey Raf,

I understand that…I didn’t mention the transcode to prores because it’s kind of a give…I wouldn’t try to edit the native h264 in the timeline…but I read someone else mention the conversion to prores AND the frame rate conform in the same step through compressor. Is that what everyone else is doing?

-Jason

[Rafael Amador]

Hi Jason
Yes, I think that is the most usual workflow.
There is no much problem cutting H264 in FC, but in the moment you try to apply filters, animate or whatever, you never know how FC will react.

[Jason Brown] “but I read someone else mention the conversion to prores AND the frame rate conform in the same step through compressor. “

When you transcode and Conform, you end up with the original picture pixel by pixel. Just wrote in a different codec.
With Compressor only when you make a Linear re-timing you keep the original picture.
The better the re-timing the more “synthetic’ is the picture.
I would never go to Compressor for this task.: MPGStreamclip and CinemaTools.
Cheers,
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com

[Jeremy Garchow]

I’m with you Dave. Get two real video cameras with a depth of field adapters and save yourself a metric shit ton of grief (you did say you were going overseas, right?).

If not, test your ass off. It’s possible, but if you’re trying to do this on a shoestring budget and a limited crew, I would say godspeed to all of that.

What you should tell the people that hold the purse strings is that, yeah, you have two little cameras that might cost relatively little money, but the sheer amount of time that you are going to spend conforming and syncing two cameras from h264 and double system sound is going to totally kill the post budget. With two video cameras that can handle the things you are trying to do right out of the box, add a DOF adapter and some lenses (hey, you can even use the lenses you were going to use on the 5D) you will save yourself time in post.

Today is swear day.

Jeremy

[Tim Kolb]

[Dave LaRonde] “If the only way you can get this project done is by using still cameras, you may want to consider saving up some more dough to get proper TV cameras, which after all are just one line item of many in your production budget, albeit a fairly crucial one.”

Hmmm… Have you guys ever seen the latitude on these cameras? I’m with you on the functionality…the video mode was really meant as a revenue-enhancer for (still)photo-journalists, but unless you plan on moving into some sort of motion-RAW DigiCine camera, there isn’t a conventional video camera that will get you the image latitude that the 5D, and lesser so, the 7D will get you.

All that said, the fastest edit scenario I’ve seen thus far has been a conversion in MPEG streamclip to XDcam (the rest of the project was shot on EX cameras so the editor’s idea was to get it all to run on the same timeline).

He could have just as easily converted to ProRes I suppose…even though the stuff wasn’t 10 bit, it was great looking…city streets at night, no additional lights. A prime adapter on a video camera will lose you a stop or two, not manufacture an additional 2…

Just another perspective.

I wouldn’t shoot a feature on a still camera…and the sound is ridiculously lacking (as is the viewing), but I can see the appeal of these cameras.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

[Bouke Vahl]

Well,
I do have a few customers who use these cams.

Dual sound is normal with video cams as well.
Timecode is around for longer than most of the users of this fora are alive, nothing fancy.

Testing, yes, very much needed.

And i agree that for run ‘n gun work traditional cams are better.

But if you control the shooting situation, using still cams is very well possible. (And the moment 24 or 25 is available i’m going to buy one!)

But if you think that two ‘real’ HD cams with DOF adapters will be cheaper in the end, think again, and go back to school to learn math.

A decent HD rig is about 50K. A still cam is about 5.
That is 90K difference for two cams.

Cost of rendering? Just time. Perhaps a few extra CPU’s at a value of 10K.
Still 80k difference.

Software? You need my stuff, that’s nothing in comparison.

Dual audio?
A BWF recorder is some 2K. Do it with a laptop and slave to LTC, it’s the price of a laptop and input board. Also close to nothing.

Bouke

https://www.videotoolshed.com/
smart tools for video pro’s