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24p & FCP, and disk space
I’ve been reading through the P2 and Varicam forums and I found a couple items that I am hoping to get input on.
1. On July 25 in the P2 forum there was a lengthy discussion about the HVX200 doing 1080/24p, Jan Livingston stated that:
“The Camera will do a 24P capture and write that to a 1080/60i recording, much like we do in the DVX100. So if you extract the 24p you will have 1080P/24.”But I’m wondering about the value of this in light of this comment by Gary Adcock on June 3 in the Varicam forum:
“In FCP5 Apple actually recommends NOT to use 1080 24psf as a film out format (and as a technical aside it was left out of the FCP 5 manual as an possible HD broadcast format) and Specifically recommends the 720p24 format for filmout work from FCP 5 / FCP studio.A couple of reasons NOT to use 1080 24psf for filmouts –720p is a truly progressive format, while the 1080psf format is actually 2 progressive frames that melded back into a single frame (called Progressive Segmented Frames), and in content with high motion that can result with an “interlaced look” even though the content is progressive.”
2. On July 20 in the P2 forum Jan Livingston wrote:
” Keep in mind that in 60 frame HD 30GB is only 30 minutes, in 24P it would probabley hold a litte more than an hour.”In light of her comment from July 25 that I’ve posted above, is not this statement about 24p valid only for 720p and not 1080p?
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6 Replies
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“720p is a truly progressive format, while the 1080psf format is actually 2 progressive frames that melded back into a single frame (called Progressive Segmented Frames), and in content with high motion that can result with an “interlaced look” even though the content is progressive.””
That’s rubbish. 1080psf24 looks identical to 1080p24, and in terms of progressiveness and motion, identical to 720p24 and does not ever look interlaced, even on high motion. I wonder where on earth people get these strange notions from?!
Graeme
– http://www.nattress.com – Film Effects and Standards Conversion for FCP
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[Curtis Hight] “In FCP5 Apple actually recommends NOT to use 1080 24psf as a film out format (and as a technical aside it was left out of the FCP 5 manual as an possible HD broadcast format) and Specifically recommends the 720p24 format for filmout work from FCP 5 / FCP studio”
As Graeme said, this makes no sense. 1080/24p from the HVX is full-fledged, pure 1080/24p. 24 progressive frames per second, at 1080 resolution. Twice as many luma samples, and twice as many color samples, as 720/24p. Better in all ways (except storage space!)[Curtis Hight] “Keep in mind that in 60 frame HD 30GB is only 30 minutes, in 24P it would probabley hold a litte more than an hour.”
In light of her comment from July 25 that I’ve posted above, is not this statement about 24p valid only for 720p and not 1080p?”
Correct — she was referencing 720/60p vs. 720/24p. In 1080 it’s always the same data rate, whether 1080/24p, 1080/30p, or 1080/60i. You always get just over one minute per gigabyte.In 720p, the slower the frame rate the less storage space it takes up. 720/60p would give you about 8 minutes of footage on an 8gb card. If you were instead to shoot 720/4p (the slowest frame rate) you’d get about two hours of footage on that same 8gb card.
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Get the most from your DVX camera. The DVX Book and DVX DVD are now available at https://www.dvxuser.com/articles/dvxbook/ and at Amazon (https://tinyurl.com/54u4a) -
[Barry Green] “1080/24p from the HVX is full-fledged, pure 1080/24p. 24 progressive frames per second, at 1080 resolution. Twice as many luma samples, and twice as many color samples, as 720/24p. Better in all ways (except storage space!)”
IF hvx200’s lens and chips deliver that resolution.
Any news about those chips?
When the camera is being shown as a working piece and specs are revealed? -
Working model will be shown at IBC, about three weeks from now.
Don’t know about when specs may be revealed. I would say Panasonic’s probably planning on letting the footage do the talking, rather than just watching another round of numbers-arguing that leads nowhere.
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Get the most from your DVX camera. The DVX Book and DVX DVD are now available at https://www.dvxuser.com/articles/dvxbook/ and at Amazon (https://tinyurl.com/54u4a) -
Sorry, but where and when is IBC held? I’d like to get my hands on one of these puppies.
Thanks,
Harry
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Amsterdam, Sept 9-13.
See you there?
Best,
Jan
Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, AG-DVX100
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems
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