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Varicam to Digibeta tranfer, stupid?
I am about to edit this commercial that is being shot on a varicam at 23.98. This commercial is going to have sync sound (most of our stuff that we do are gfx based and don’t have sync sound…so our “production” people are not that well versed in it). Anyhow, they are shooting on the varicam but want to get it transfered to digibeta for editing. Why? I have no idea. They want me to edit with the digibeta footage and then they are going to have me spit out an edl and get the selects telecined from the source HD tapes. I suggested to them that we just rent a 1200A or something and bring it in HD (the spot is going to be an SD spot in the end). I will not be able to remove the dupe frames if they get it transfered to digibeta, right? The varicam does not do a standard 3:2 pulldown, but duplicates the frames when it records to tape and then the firewire stream has those frames flagged for removal (at least this is how I understand it). Now, I have not done any tests with sound sync and these cameras, but say I did not remove these dupe frames, will my sound be in sync with my picture? Or does it work out that it is only in sync once I remove the frames and make my picture 23.98?. Does this sound like a really dumb idea to transfer to digibeta? It seems really unnecessary to me. I don’t know how much different the price would be to transfer to digibeta over renting the deck…but I am sure it would be negligable (possibly even cheaper to rent the deck?).
Thanks,
EliEli Mavros
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8 Replies
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[Eli Mavros] “They want me to edit with the digibeta footage and then they are going to have me spit out an edl and get the selects telecined from the source HD tapes.”
Yes, it is stupid. It will add complexity and muck up a project that is really rather simple.
Capturing DVCPRO HD natively will take up VERY little space (22GB/hour) , and you can work 23.98 natively, not have to capture then remove telecine. And you don’t have to mess with EDLs or anything else that can much you up. You don’t need a capture card…all you need is the DVCPRO HD Deck.
DVCPRO HD is a highly compressed, yet very good looking form of HD. If you were shooting HDCAM or HDCAM SR, then I’d suggest transferring to DVCPRO HD for offline. I can’t see going to digibeta for offline. that just makes no sense to me. The people are thinking very old fashioned offline/online thoughts.
You will need a firewire 800 or SATA Raid to edit this footage, however. G-Raids do nicely.
Shane
Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net -
Wow. I would say a transfer to Digibeta is goofy. You have some options. First would be to edit in 720p24. You can rent the deck, capture in 720p24, edit, online, and conform/color correct for SD in SD in real time with a Kona series card and the 3:2 pulldown will be added upon play out to your SD master. You can also rent the 1200 deck and make sure that it has the SD SDI option installed (most rental houses fully populate their decks anyway). You can then digitize SD out of the 1200A, then edit, online and color correct that way. You will be performing the sync sound yourself. What is the sound recorded on by the way?
720p24 material actually has 3:2 pulldown, it’s just that the frames are progressive and not interlaced. That’s the simple version anyway. You could also digitize at 720p60 and edit that way, then color correct in downconverted SD with a Kona card.
Jeremy
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You can also tell the 1200A to output a downconverted SD DV format over firewire. I did this for my last project for offline editing. When it came time to finish, I batch captured using the 720p24 setting and it worked great. Only issue was an occasional gap of 1 frame missing which had to be pulled out (this is just something that happens when going from 30fps to 24).
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Thanks guys for reconfirming what I already suspected. It is always good to hear other people’s opinions on such things before telling people to change their plans. By the way, we have a Kona LS here and I have more storage than I need (SCSI and FW800 drives…so not concerned about that). I have put in my two cents…hopefully they listen. If not, I am sure I will make it work, whatever workflow they choose. If they do go down the digibeta route though, will I have sync issues, or will I be cool? You were saying that there is a standard 3:2 pulldown inserted on the tape? This is news to me, but that would be great. So this means: if for some reason they wanted to work at 24fps I could concievably bring the footage captured from the digibeta into Cinema Tools and do a reverse telecine and get the same effect as if I just brought the varicam footage in over FW removing the extra frames?
Best,
Eli MavrosEli Mavros
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[Eli Mavros] “You were saying that there is a standard 3:2 pulldown inserted on the tape? This is news to me, but that would be great. So this means: if for some reason they wanted to work at 24fps I could concievably bring the footage captured from the digibeta into Cinema Tools and do a reverse telecine and get the same effect as if I just brought the varicam footage in over FW removing the extra frames? “
Correct, but I doubt they will want to work at 23.98, especially if it’s for broadcast. You can also do a realtime reverse telecine on your LS (no Cinema Tools) if you set it up properly. If you have only a Kona LS and not an LH, then you need to do the Sd-SDI option and edit in SD. AS far as sync sound, how was it recorded?
Jeremy
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Oops…i meant that we have an LH, not an LS.
Best,
EliEli Mavros
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Edit in HD…do everything at DVCPRO HD. WHen you need to deliver a digibeta…downconvert your final project in a 29.97 timeline. Don’t edit digibeta downconverts.
Shane
Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net -
Thanks for all the responses…luckly I was able to convince them to rent the deck and forget about the digibeta nonsense. So far smooth sailing.
Best,
Eli MavrosEli Mavros
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