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What a Pain! – 3 Camera Edit Workflow Issue
Hey All,
I really need some advice. Yesterday I woas given a 3 camera editing job that was shot on location earlier this year. Typically I can blow through a job like this no problem, but I have encountered a few challenges on this one that I am not sure how to handle.Here is the deal:
The project consists of a three camera shoot (I was not on location for the shoot).
Camera 1 – Shot the Host with a close up and recorded her audio only – Running Non Drop frame timecode at hour 14
Camera 2 – Shot the Guest with a close up and recorded her audio only – Running Drop frame timecode also at hour 14 (the timecodes of c1 and c2 match)
Camera 3 – Shot a wide of the two guests but ran no reference audio – Time code is drop frame but does not match c1 or c2It was my hope that there was a way to work with camera 1 and 2 in group clip mode so that at least I have a base to work with but can not lock the timecode because on is drop frame the other is non drop. So I thought to myself ok then put an in point on each clip at the same timecode and group clip that way…no go I the audio doeas not sync up… you can hear a big lag in the bleeds of the mics.
Any ideas? Is there a way to match these tapes with some sort of mathmatical equation? Is my only hope to match these by ear the best I can?
Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
System Specs:
Avid Xpress Pro v5.7.5
Window XP SP2
HP Workstation xw4100 Pentium 4 2.60 GHz 2 gig RAM
After Effects v7.0 -
4 Replies
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Sounds like if you only want to use one audio track, you will need to match waveforms ahead of time with a marker, then sync up from there. You can also set the multicam edit to use audio from each camera in the edit if you feel you can match that for a mix.
Michael
Michael Phillips
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Michael,
My task today has been to try and match this stuff up. I like your idea of using the waveform to do so. I wound using verbal cues and laying each camera on the timeline then nudging one way or the other until there was no phasing. Not the cleanest way to do it but it seems to be working.
I was hoping there was some calculation I could do to convert from non drop to drop frame, I tried reading up on how to use the calculator tool but I did not have much success putting it into practice.
Thanks for your reply.
System Specs:
Avid Xpress Pro v5.7.5
Window XP SP2
HP Workstation xw4100 Pentium 4 2.60 GHz 2 gig RAM
After Effects v7.0 -
Well if Cam 1 and 2 or drop and non-drop, matching up TC to put an in mark, won’t work as the some frames have been dropped, the TC really might have the same number, but it’s counting it a different way, so it’s not necessarily the same moment.
There is a formula you can use, but I’d look for some audio or visual cues first. Usually you can find an eyeblink, cough something that will help you out. This is why, even though I’ve worked with my camera guys for years and I know they will correctly sync the cameras, give me plenty of preroll…they will always give me a slate marker on all multi-camera shoots—just in case.
Here’s the formulas—good luck.
12. Convert non-drop frame timecode to drop frame timecode:
Drop frame timecode adds 2 frames every minute, but not when the minute ends in 0 (minute 10, 20, 30, etc.).
1. Ignore hours.
2. Multiply minutes by 2
3. Take the left-most integer of the original minutes column and multiply by 2.
4. Subtract (c) from (b).
5. Add the result, in frames, to the non-drop frame value.
6. Convert frames to seconds, as needed (30 frames = 1 second).Example: Convert 07:32:56:27 non-drop to drop frame timecode
Double the minutes: 32 x 2 = 64
Double the left-most minutes integer: 3 x 2 = 6
Subtract: 64 – 6 = 58
Add the result to the frames column: 27 + 58 = 85
Convert to seconds: 85 / 30 = 2 with a remainder of 25, or 2 seconds 25 frames.The answer is 07;32;58;25
13. Convert drop frame timecode to non-drop frame timecode:
1. Ignore the hours column.
2. Double the minutes column.
3. Double the left-most integer of the minutes column.
4. Subtract that from the doubled minutes.
5. Continue as in #12, but subtract from the frames column.Johnny Cuevas, Editor
http://www.ckandco.net -
Hey Brian, I do what you are doing right now for a living and you have the right idea. Unfortunately there is no mathematical equation for you situation that I know about because if your cameras were not synced up (jam sync, ran through one deck, etc.) then you can’t really calculate this. You would need to find out how many frames you are off and in which direction and then account for the drop frame camera’s timecode. Seems to me like what you are doing (grouping by in points) is the best way to my knowledge. It’s time consuming and sucks, but the most reliable way.
Frankie
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