[Matthew Abourezk]

Hi Phil,

Moire? Ugh. Although I don’t doubt you, I have a hard time imagining that moire could be this intrusive on a surface that really doesn’t have much in the way of small details. If it is this easy for moire to jump in and destroy a scene, I can’t imagine that the 5D (or any DSLR) would have gained the traction it did.

I especially have a hard time imagining that this problem suddenly showed up on two long takes, but is not evident in ANY of the footage shot before or after.

Keeping in mind that this was an 8-hour, three camera shoot (all Canon 5d MKII), and the main camera was locked on a tripod with a 50mm lens all day. Literally locked, no camera moves, no changes in camera settings, no changes in the lighting or set. The only thing the camera operator did on that camera all day was start and stop the recording.

Again, why would the problem appear in only two of the clips from the same camera, not before, and not after, of the exact same shot?

Could this be because of the internal temperature of the camera? Does Moire appear more easily if the sensor is at the top of its temperature range?

Anyway, thanks for the reply.
Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 249-7718

[Matthew Abourezk]

After further investigation, there are two long takes that show this problem. (Unfortunately they are both needed because they are a major section for the edited video.)

The problem is evident from the beginning to the end of each clip. (camera start to stop)
The problem is not evident in the clips before or after the two damaged clips.

The focus is better on the clips that don’t show the color problem, but the focus is still not as good as what we saw on the monitor when we shot.

It is just so strange that this shows up only for a couple of takes. We were definitely running the cameras until they hit the 12 minute auto-shut off, but in this case, the camera had been sitting idle for quite a while as we set up for the next scene. I have three cameras running, no weird problems with the other cameras.

Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 249-7718

[Matthew Abourezk]

Right you are Noah.

I went back to the P2 cards and found one of the affected clips (the rest from the previous day had unfortunately been written over since I thought then ingest went well and had checked a sampling of clips to make sure).
Anyway, the one clip which had previously shown an fps of 9.99 was just fine on the P2 card. I re-ingested that clip and it plays normally. So the problem had been that randomly, some of the clips ingested improperly.

This is an extremely unnerving problem. It is already scary enough to ingest then erase the P2 cards. So much so that I carry a G-Safe raid array with me to redundantly copy the files to two separate drives at the same time. Now I have run into a problem where random clips can import incorrectly? Ugh.

Anyway, thanks for the input, at least I know what went wrong.

Now I just need to figure out where the problem came from… the notebook computer? The G-raid? Communication between the two? Why would this randomly show itself?

I’m now thinking that the safest thing to do is to buy a lot of extra P2 cards so I don’t have to re-write over anything, even in a two-day shoot.
Ugh x 2

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 249-7718

[Matthew Abourezk]

I feel your pain brother…

I sent the camera to…
Nivie Electronics
Panasonic Authorized Service
work 718-765-0123
work 140 58TH STREET, Suite 7b
Brooklyn NY 11220

They were fast, inexpensive, knew of the problem and had the parts in stock.
Best of luck,
Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 249-7718

[Matthew Abourezk]

I just got my camera back, seems fine now. The cost (including shipping to New Jersey) was almost $300. Repair took about a week.

I’m still chapped about Panasonic not taking any responsibility for this, but as I was told, there is only about 1% of the owners that have publicly reported this problem.

Since this is a problem that seems to appear whether the camera is used or not, I suspect that percentage will increase.

Best of luck to you. At least we know this is a cheap and easy fix.

Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 249-7718

[Matthew Abourezk]

Hi Jan,

Thanks for the reply. I am getting the job fixed for $270, which is reasonable compared to others that have apparently had the same problem.

The only issue I have is that this is clearly a manufacturing defect on the part of Panasonic and it only affects a range of HVX 200’s that were made in 2007/08. It is known (now) by Panasonic that there are a couple of cables/contacts that corrode due to an issue with the metals used. Panasonic has since fixed this production problem, (and the repair I am paying for will cause the problem to not recur).

I don’t share the perspective of many posters that I have seen in various forums, that this is an example of Panasonic selling inferior products, but it seems to me that Panasonic needs to officially step up to the plate and accept responsibility for this issue. Your clients made the HVX 200 very popular, and a vocal and growing percentage of those clients are now frustrated by a problem that was accidentally introduced by Panasonic, you are creating an environment of ill will with those that you depend on. I am VERY interested in moving up to the newer cameras being introduced by Panasonic, but this experience has left me (and apparently quite a few others) concerned about your commitment to excellence.

Obviously, every technology manufacturer in the world has at one time or another, tripped on a previously unforeseen bug, goes with the territory. But in this economy, none of us should have to cover the cost of an issue that was not of our doing. Nor should we have to plead with a repair service and hope for compliance.

I have been shooting with Canon cameras for the past 16 years with literally not one technology glitch in that time. I took the leap to Panasonic with the HVX 200, and after only having used the camera for a short while, it died. Now I find that this is a known issue by Panasonic.

In closing, again, Panasonic needs to do the right thing for its customers. It is a small financial commitment to a company the size of Panasonic, it would be an important act of good will toward those in the community that bought your products, (who will eventually buy more products) and those who network with many other potential Panasonic clients. If nothing else, in this day of age, no manufacturer can afford the bad press that is so easily distributed via the internet.

Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 327-6617

[Matthew Abourezk]

Hi Jan,

I don’t mean to sound too confrontational, but there is a groundswell of evidence that the buttons dying on the HVX 200 is a known problem by Panasonic. This is a hardware bug that three of your authorized service providers have confirmed is known by Panasonic. To the point that they know exactly the cost of the repair and have the parts in stock.

My HVX 200 was barely used in the past year, and in each case of use, it was a studio situation with the camera being treated by me as a valuable tool. Really, this camera could be sold as new.

I was very surprised to fire up the camera the other day, on the way to a shoot, and find that it had developed this problem where the menu buttons and VCR button quit working.

I ended up losing that shoot which cost me $650.

Now I am facing a $300 repair charge.

The question I have, is Panasonic going to take responsibility for this hardware bug and cover the cost of repair? It is the right thing to do for your customers.

Please respond with your thoughts. Again, I am not (in any way) trying to be a jerk, but there should be some accountability for this hardware bug.

My email address is matt@talkingboxdmg.com and I would love to hear from you.

Thanks Jan,
Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 327-6617

[Matthew Abourezk]

Hi Walter and Shane,

Regarding Array…
(gulp) No array, just four internal hard disks. (and about 10 terabytes of G-Raid drives…. bought one at a time as needed… formatted for use as single hard drives). I guess the time has come to hot rod this puppy.

I have such a massive amount of files that I (like many of my peers) are scrambling to try to find a way to keep up with the current work as well as to archive project assets for a reasonable amount of time…. Devoting a couple of drives to an array seemed like a waste of valuable space… guess I need to get over it, stripe two of the drives as an array that I use only for current editing?
Your thoughts are appreciated.

Regarding project footage…
Again, I am probably in the same boat as my peers, but I am receiving every conceivable file format under the sun and combining them into a single timeline. HD 720, 1080, DV, DVCPro 50, DVCPro HD, Animation files, as well as Illustrator vector images, PSD files, 16 megapixel still photographs, etc…. Rendering every time I touch anything is now my reality. I don’t remember the last time I got to drop clips in a timeline and experiment freely without having to render constantly.

I probably need to take a course on file format workflow in FCP and Motion. The situation has gotten pretty overwhelming, very quickly.

Matt

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 327-6617

[Matthew Abourezk]

Okay then,

I am getting a better picture of what is going on. The problem relates to a combination of Apple ProRes422 (including Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) in a frame that is 4:3. Doesn’t matter what the pixel aspect ratio or any other settings are. If I drop a DVCPRO HD clip into a timeline, change the frame size to any flavor of 4:3, the playback and exported clips are unsaturated. If I change the frame size to anything but a 4:3 ratio, the playback is fine.

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 327-6617

[Matthew Abourezk]

Hi again,

I just performed a test that again points to Apples ProRes 422 HQ as the culprit.

I dropped a DVCPRO HD clip into a new sequence and allowed to sequence to automatically set to the clips settings.

No rendering, played just as saturated as it looked when not playing.
Added a text layer which forced a render, still looked good playing.
Changed the pixel aspect ratio to square and the frame size to 640 x 480, still good playback.
Changed the Quicktime Video Settings to Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) and the playback became unsaturated again. I don’t know if it is a combination of multiple settings above, but the problem most definitely occurred only when I changed the sequence to ProRes.

Talkingbox Digital Media Group, Inc.
http://www.talkingboxdmg.com
(203) 327-6617