Chris Blair
Forum Replies Created
-
Guys,
We get clients who want to put the highest quality video on their internet sites and aren’t satisfied until we output videos compressed between 1000-2000kbs.
The video plays great on new computers with fast connections, but on many, it takes quite a while to buffer before it starts playing, and even then, it will buffer several more times during playback.
What do most site visitors do when this happens? They either don’t watch the video or they move on to a new page..or worse..a new website. If David’s site is strictly for watching his videos, then by all means, do them at the highest quality you can get away with or that customers will tolerate.
But if it’s a typical business website where people go to get information as well as watch video, it’s better to make the videos smaller (both in pixel and file size), and make sure they’ll play continuously.
The 10MB/minute file size doesn’t sound outrageous, but from the clients we work with, it’s certainly on the upper end of what’s going to play reliably across a wide range of users. We shoot for 6-8MB/minute at a smaller size of 640×360 (depending on the content) or even 512×288 at 5-6MB/minute.
If quality and showing the video at a large size is important, then he’ll have to live with the fact that likely half his audience will have buffering issues during playback.
The servers the videos are on also make a difference.
We have one client that uses Limelight for their CDN, which caches video on their servers, (theoretically improving playback), yet we’ve been unable to get 640×360 video at 10MB/min to play reliably on a large number of connections. The client settled on 512×288 at around 8MB/minute as their default because it plays reliably and still looks very good.
If you’re hosting the videos on your web sever, you’re not going to get the same performance as you would from hosting them on a Content Delivery Network separate from your website.
And to clarify, my home cable connection tests at about half the speed of our office T1 line. This illustrates that more than just the connection speed impacts playback. Your CPU, RAM, graphic card and its settings, Flash versions, etc. all can impact performance. After the video is delivered, your CPU still has to decompress it and your graphic card still has to process it.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Craig SeemanSuperficially your frame size and data rate is reasonable given the above.
It’s reasonable for SOME people with new computers and very fast internet connections.
As an example…we have workstation class computers at our facility, most with at least dual processors and several gigs of RAM…along with a T1 line. Yet if only one person is on the internet, we have a hard time playing YouTube HD files without buffering, pausing and stuttering…regardless of the power of the workstation.
At home I have a pretty standard cable connection and a 4 year old laptop with 512MB RAM…yet I can play YouTube HD video without issue.
There are so many potential issues that affect streaming video that bumping up against the boundaries of it’s capabilities in pixel size and data rates means that a large percentage of your audience likely won’t be able to reliably play your video.
Forget the fact that they SHOULD be able to play it, the simple fact is that many will not be able to. We’ve always advised clients that it’s better for their video to play at good quality, than it is for it to look pristine but pause and stutter…or not play at all.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Ismael,
We’re not knocking you for wanting to try to build a shared storage system for as little money as possible. That’s what Bob’s article was all about in the first place. But what we continually see on the forum is people (not just you…but many people) asking for advice…getting very specific answers, and then responding that they’re going to do it their way anyway. They also want to take “spare parts” they’ve got lying around and build a working NAS or SAN for video editing…like it’s some sort of science project. Working systems tax even high-end hardware and software…so it’s just crazy to expect old hardware to do the job.
It makes no sense to come to a forum asking for FREE advice, get it…then not follow it. The information that people dole out in here is information that IT companies charge $100/hour and up for. The majority of the advice is based on real-world experience in working facilities.
So don’t misunderstand anyone’s intent here. We all want to help. But when people don’t listen and follow the recommendations, it starts to feel like we’re all beating our heads against a wall. Sharing video across fibre channel is hard enough. Doing it across ethernet is even harder. Everything has to be configured properly for it to work, and robust hardware and software has to be used.
So…we want you to succeed. And I’ll help Bob configure it for free if you fly me to Spain with him!
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Is it just me…or do a lot of people post questions about how to setup a SAN or NAS system, get very specific answers from people who have done it, then reply that they’re going to do it their way anyway?
Am I just reading the replies from people incorrectly or is that what others are reading?
I like helping people with whatever knowledge and experience I have, and lord knows there are several others on this list with a LOT more real-world video and file sharing experience than me, but if people that post and get answers aren’t going to follow the advice they’re given, it seems sort of pointless to post in the first place.
So folks..if you post with questions about how to do something, especially building a DIY SAN, the people on this list have done it. They’ve done the trial and error for you. They’ve failed over and over and figured out why stuff works or doesn’t work. Why on earth would you want to waste your time making the mistakes others have already made and figured out how to fix??
Ok…I feel better. Just had to get that off my chest.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
We use Quickbooks but we DO list services based on the amount of time spent, typically in hours, but some services ae based on half-day or full-day rates.
We also prepare bids and estimates this way rather than just throwing out a flat amount. We’ve actually had dozens of clients tell us they prefer our method, usually after having been burned by other production companies that just bill a set price that ends up higher than their estimate…explaining to the client that this or that took longer, or this service wasn’t specified etc.
Clients tell us, especially in this economy, that they want to see exactly what they’re getting for their money and they don’t want surprises.
It also allows a client to see how time is distributed on a project and we’ve had many corporate marketing people tell us it helps them plan future projects…since they’re often handling all sorts of projects from print to point of purchase to video etc., they’re often not as saavy about budgeting for video…so they pull out their previous estimates and invoices and can see exactly where they spent time and money before.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Thanks for the tips. I’m not sure what version I’m demoing as I downloaded it a while back and have just recently gotten around to testing it. I’ll download the latest version. I’ve read the tutorials that come with the demo and don’t recall any of the tips you list being in them.
Seems like this would be good information to include for folks, don’t you think??
As I said, I’m relatively experienced with 3D work, and I did adjust the object faceting, but didn’t realize it would slow workflow if I had it set to the highest setting (which I did).
Graphic drivers are all updated. I’m not exactly sure what you’re referring to on controller drivers. I’m assuming hard drive controllers? We use shared storage for projects and rendering. All workstations run programs off the local drives, but they are all workstation class systems optimized by IBM and HP for video editing. I seriously doubt the local drive controllers would have an impact on the performance of Proanimator.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
I often find myself in a situation where the video file I am given needs to be converted into something readable by Final Cut Pro or Adobe Premier, etc…
Don’t we all..
At the moment I am using Quicktime Pro to export a
Video file, (AVC coding, AAC, Stereo exported as H.264 (.mov), WAV)
It has been exporting for over an hour and is not even 1/4th of the
way completed.I’m curious why Final Cut can’t read the original file. I don’t use Final Cut, but from what I do know…it should be able to play an H264/AAC encoded file. Also…how long is this file and is it HD, SD?
Am I crazy for thinking 10 minutes is impossible when considering
how long it takes to edit, import/export and encode/compress videos?No…you’re not crazy. If you’re getting files that Final Cut cannot read natively, then conversion should be a scheduled and billable part of the process. Just about everyone in the industry underestimates how long it takes to properly transcode something.
What would you do in these kinds of situations?
I’d tell the people that expect it to take 10 minutes that they’re being unreasonable and tell them to sit-in on a project and watch what it takes to get it done. Pick the most ornerous video file you’ve ever gotten so they can see the time it takes to convert.
How long do you generally spend on getting small projects completed?
Impossible to answer that without a lot more detail, but we don’t ever tell a client something will take less than 30 minutes. And at 30 minutes it would have to be uber simple…like changing a graphic or two or switching out a handful of shots, or changing one music cut etc.
Is there anything out there that handles encoding/compression better than Quicktime Pro? (Sorenson Squeeze?, etc…)
Just about anything is better than Quicktime Pro. It’s not a dedicated encoding app. Others on the list can give you Mac specific suggestions but I know a lot of people use Telestream products with great success. Sorenson is ok, certainly better than Quicktime Pro, but middle of the pack from posts I’ve read on here.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Digital Rapids solutions are pretty darn good. They have a number of different combinations of hardware/software and turnkey systems. Most of the other companies that sell encoding hardware that I’m aware of don’t seem to offer as well-integrated an approach as Digital Rapids does.
Some of the people that started Digital Rapids were the same people that started DPS, which created the Perception PVR, then the Velocity line of editing products (now owned by Harris Corp). So they know video capture, processing and encoding very well. I know a couple of people that use their turnkey solutions and they rave about them, both the functionality and reliability of them.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
Yes…a good point. It’s easy to get caught up thinking that combing numbers and specs will result in certain peformance levels without remembering there are thresholds and real-world limits.
I think advertising agencies MUST’VE named all the computer industry’s devices, since the names bear little relation to real-world performance. I remember setting up our first networked computers in the mid-90s and having a hard time understanding why our 100MB/sec ethernet would only move data at about 5MB/sec.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com -
I think I pointed that out in my post when I said you couldn’t expect those line speeds and that it was a simplistic explanation of how things work.
Naturally if you’re using a connection with a maximum throughput of 1GB, you’ll never exceed that. I was just trying to explain the theory behind link aggregation…that combining cards can give you a significant boost in speed.
And while I respect everyone in this forum, I don’t see why it’s a bad thing that a high school kid aspires to build a shared video editing system for his school. I applaud him! 18 months ago I didn’t know diddley about this stuff. But after months of reading, research, asking questions on here, and talking to dozens of companies and their reps, I was able to garner a pretty broad understanding of how all this stuff works.
I’m certainly no expert and have no desire to be. But I thought the spirit of these forums was to help people. Who cares how old he is or how inexperienced he might be? I wish half my employees had this kid’s moxy and audacity.
I wish him luck and if others on this list can build a working NAS or SAN with no prior knowledge, why can’t a bright 17 year old?
I joined the Cow about 4 years ago, spent a couple weeks on forums, then immediately left because of the negative and arrogant tone that permeates a lot of these forums. Despite the fact that I had 21 years of experience at the time, Emmy awards and a wall lined with other awards, I was treated like I was an idiot by a few individuals…and on most forums was repeatedly admonished with responses to valid questions with answers like:
“this has been covered…do a search.”
When in fact the subject HAD NOT been covered. It usually had been skirted and discussed on the fringes of other discussions. On one question I asked, a moderator answered that I was wasting everyone’s time, including his! Thankfully, I don’t see that person on any forums anymore, so perhaps he got his comeuppance.
But I’ll help the young lad as much as he wants or needs thank you very much. And I hope he succeeds in his efforts.
Chris Blair
Magnetic Image, Inc.
Evansville, IN
http://www.videomi.com