Bill Davis
Forum Replies Created
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Very nice of you Steve, but I deserve nothing. This is the vision and brainpower of the X team who have obviously kept their eyes on a picture bigger than just incrementing on what’s already known. Only thing I can claim is justification for my faith that the X team was always working hard to improve things for their users. Pretty happy today. And typing this on the flight to Cupertino to see much more, I hope. Good times ahead!
PS, finally the “new look” dam has broken and I can get back to building out XinTwo – it’s been SO frustrating for the past 6 months!Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Andrew Kimery] “Any criticism of X you explain away as either user error, user ignorance, irrelevant because the way X does it is better and/or irrelevant “
Let’s play a word swap game…
“Any PRAISE of X you explain away as either user thinking error, user ignorance, irrelevant because the way X does things is actually no better…”
Sound familiar?
Perhaps because that’s essentially a primary argument proffered in this forum in this thread?
; )
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
Awesome response. Thanks for taking the time to write it.
So my thinking…
– The lack of true background rendering/transcoding/export in FCPX
I work with background rendering turned off 95% of the time. X still displays eminently workable screens and near instantly renders screens of anything I stop on in my content so I always know what the final quality of my work will be – By postponing the rendering until the output stage, X can dedicate all it’s processing power to rendering for the master, rather than interrupting for “renders in progress” which tends to annoy me more.– The inability to read .mts files natively without rewrapping (and other codecs the program doesn’t natively support)
I see those as IP issues. X does fine with all the codecs Apple has licenses to directly support. For those they don’t – they chose not to pay royalties. It’s just business.– The inability to flatten multicam edits or apply stabilization to them
I stabilize via “open in timeline” as part of prep. I don’t want to extend a scene and have to constantly re-render – which I’d have to do if I wanted to make changes to a “flattened” multi-cam edit in my storylines. I tend to fiddle with them always looking for a better cut until right at the end. If they would do that I’d use it. But it’s not my workflow now.– Lack of multiple timecode displays
I only use visible timecode for client string-outs. I don’t care what the timecode of anything is – so long as I can find exactly what I need via keywords. X thinking for sure. And I understand editors doing other types of work who live and breath TC – I just don’t anymore.– Lack of keyboard control when working with connected clips and secondary storylines
More would always be nice. But I use them mostly for cutaways – not complex construction. So it’s not a big deal. If I find I have too many secondaries, I’ll Snapshot and drop them into my primary, knowing that I can always go back and “rescue” my prior storyline construction if need be. It keeps me making “iterations” which I often find useful if I make U-turns in my storyline thinking. Charlie Austin figured out a neat trick for near instant Auto Archiving Snapshots via Smart Collections – and that’s my go to modality now.– Inability to mix proxy and original/optimized media in an edit
You may be working with extreme resolutions – and this might be important because of that – but for me, if the shot footage resolution demands a Proxy workflow – I’m totally content to stay there right up until Mastering. X’s proxies ROCK. Horses for courses.– Poor relinking
Disappears as an issue with proper library management. I still largely rely on Sparse Disk Bundles or dedicated clone drives when I use Referenced Media as my default footage storage mode. With bundles, no matter which clone you launch, X “sees” it as original media and everything re-links. Same with Libraries created and mounted on a single external Volume. Learn VOLUME management and mounting – and it’s not a big deal – at least the way I work. For facilities guys, it’s probably a bigger deal. But it’s just not an issue for me.– Lack of layout customization
This could be improved. But I also kinda like knowing I have one adaptable arrangement for multiple screen work, and a couple for working laptop single screen – and I’ll typically be in one of those modes. I learned X on a laptop. So I’m a single screen, trackpad oriented guy now. Moving pallets and panes around to accommodate different tasks isn’t something I miss at the moment. Maybe that will change soon. Who knows?– No CDL or custom LUT support (without a third party program – I want batch, source side custom LUT/CDL application)
That’s the X way of things. Make the program as good as possible at the core, then let 3rd parties add the things smaller constituencies need. I need color correction a LOT for some shoots – and don’t touch it for others. Oddly, the cheaper the cameras where my footage comes from, the less I seem to need to correct it. I’m working with some iPhone 7+ footage right now on a small project – and it’s positively gold as shot. Looks awesome. The C-300 stuff I get is all over the place. And Raw is Raw. I shot projects for 20 years without much camera shading and things were fine. White balance in the field was a religion. And all light was tungsten or daylight. Simple. Now, without tweeking every scene and shot, it’s a mess. That’s kinda weird to me. Oh well.– No ability to apply roles in the event, after an edit has started, and update a sequence with the new roles
Yep. Metadata flow Discipline is a VALUABLE skill to learn in X. I will not argue that at all.– Lack of roles based audio effects (to act like a track based effect in other NLEs)
Not touching this other than to say editors weened on traditional systems have had what I feel is a quite rationally hard time mentally releasing “tracks” for ever now. I found it easy. Keep your hopes up. ; )– Sync indicators when detaching audio.
Again, I think about audio differently now. I detach it with great reluctance. I often find ways to not have to. When I DO have to – it’s a big red flag for me and I feel I have aliens running around my storylines hell bent on hurting me later. Oh well.Michael,
Your points were well described, cogent, and I know they’ll resonate with a LOT of editors.
All I can say is that everything you’re asking for seems to me to fall into a large category of “things I know I want and don’t have.” That’s TOTALLY fair. It’s what a LOT of the X debate has been about. Editors with experience with other programs, wanting those very useful things in X. I get that.
BUT…
I’ve always said the things about X that attract me to is are generally NOT the things that have been part of the canon of NLE language for decades. Those things are nice, but not important. What IS important (to me at least) are the things that have been largely UNIMAGINED to this point. X had a major dusting of that when it was released. I want more of THAT.
As EXCELLENT as your list is, I think it’s perhaps, kinda that. Great “wants,” but nearly all already well known and hoped for.
I remember saying basically. I want Apple to SURPRISE me with things I haven’t dreamed about yet.
Still my hope.
(Well, I do have some ideas about the Voiceover Tool and audio recording workflows in X, because that’s something I do a LOT. Maybe someday I’ll gently poke my friends in Cupertino about that!)
But overall, I want to just keep having what I have right now. A tool that I sit at most days – and at the end of the day – I’ve effectively moved my work really well forward.
Loved the post tho. Thanks for taking the time to respond. Lets do more!
: )
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Michael Hancock] “Maybe take a deep breath and realize it’s just an NLE, and one with many, many flaws? Like all of them. If you really want to introduce people to the wonders and joys of FCPX, you can’t be afraid to recognize where it’s inadequate and needs improvement. Go hang out on the official Avid forums for a week. You’ll see pretty quickly how people can both love and loathe their software in the interest of making it better.”
Okay,
Let’s examine your premise.
You argue that there are “many many flaws” in X.
I argue that after nearly 200 delivered programs with it personally, I haven’t experienced a single program construction flaw to the extent I couldn’t complete and deliver my jobs with speed and success. So I’d suggest what you are seeing as “flaws” are perhaps really just minor assaults on traditional expectations and minor inconveniences that can safely be ignored in most use cases. Not saying it’s optimal for everyone, only that it’s unique strengths can often trump it’s weaknesses quite handily for those who learn it well.As to our need to advocate to “make it better” – Apple is already doing that. I say that with confidence as someone who got to see the NDA presentations at NAB. They regularly listen. I’ve seen them videotaping editor surveys at NAB and other professional venues. They also tend to go well beyond “just listening” with an eye to real innovation – something I think that will become clear very soon.
So for me, we’re down to three interesting questions. One, whether the gigs I’m having such success with are significantly different from a “typical” one. Two, whether other editors having trouble with X are farther from the modern norm and don’t need or want the tools it offers and THATS why they perhaps find it lacking.
Or whether there is no “typical” gig any more – only unique challenges where the toolset needs to have a particularly broad capability to benefit the largest number of editors who might want to deploy it.
I’ve contended for a long time that the editors most likely to dismiss X’s capabilities are those who bring hardened workflow expectations to X – and keep seeing it in terms of what they have “lost” – as opposed to what they have gained.
But feel free to list its flaws from your perspective. And let’s examine them from the view of what “most” editors are likely to require.
BTW, just for discussions sake, on another board earlier today an industry insider in a good position to know – opined about 2.2 million active X seats worldwide, a bit less than 3 times MORE than it’s nearest NLE competitor. He also pointed out that the Bureau of Labor Stastics only lists about 25,000 full time professional editors in the US labor pool and noted that the vast majority of those folks are still cutting on AVID systems.
That “might” indicate X is actually doing really well in open global competition despite the nature of the discussion here.
IF that’s true, The X approach is actually succeeding handily. So make your case as to what those “flaws” in that approach might be.
If those stats are flawed (and feel free to post better if you can find them) we can discuss what it lacks, compared to what you, me, or the industry in general needs going forward.
It’ll be fun.
FWIW
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Neil Goodman] “Sometimes I have a really hard time believing your a teacher. If you approach your job, the same way yo approach this forum…SMH.. poor kids.”
Well, that’s kinda rude.
Maybe, it’s just what Robin does HERE.
In a place where we’ve been arguing in EXACTLY this way for more than 5 years.
Perhaps the way he approaches his job is no different than someone who stands in a classroom for hours doing a great job – then heads for the Pizza joint and sings Opera for a few hours each night.
Different personalities being displayed in different circumstances. What a concept.
Personally, I see this as the one place I simply don’t have the right to be annoyed by others behavior, because participation is completely optional. Being challenged, is the CENTRAL mode here. If you don’t like having your pre-conceptions challenged – to be pushed at – it’s a bad place to hang.
Just another potential way to see things.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Michael Hancock] “Perhaps I’m just reading your posts wrong, but they come across as very condescending and dismissive most of the time, and I feel like it limits what could otherwise be a interesting and honest conversation about FCPX and it’s strengths and weaknesses, particularly in regards to the design choices Apple has made and whether they are an improvement over the classic NLE design, given different workflows.”
Having been relentlessly accused of the same thing (being condescending) for years here, I’ll just note that some of it might be the disconnect between the actual experience of some of us as “early adopters” – who saw a whole lot to like in the X approach, but had to undergo months and months and months of relentlessly having our experience, viewpoints and actual professional competency questioned. Relentlessly.
What I often thought I was doing was reacting to the constant onslaught of mis-information about X from people who very often actually didn’t really understand the program very well.
Sometimes, I’m sure I projected that onto people who DID know what they were arguing about. But when you’re house has been under constant attack for a long time, it’s unreasonable to expect the homeowner to keep answering the door with an automatic smile. Even when it’s just a brand new postman introducing him or herself.
So if you weren’t here for the first few years, my advice is to ignore the tone and look for the actual arguments lurking beneath.
Those who didn’t have strong opinions and the personalities to stand by and argue them (often relentlessly!) are long gone now. Whats left are perhaps the scarred battlers with enough “quick twitch” muscles to have survived.
So don’t be surprised if we occasionally jump.
It’s what we do. ; )
FWIW.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
Not taking sides in this, but honestly Herb, I think it’s really questionable to call someone out over a post they’ve subsequently deleted.
Most of us here have occasionally posted something that, on reflection, we wouldn’t have if we’d given it more thought.
That’s why delete is a thing.
And it’s something I think should be respected on all sides.
Just my 2cents.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
From their published recall limitations – (machines shipped during 3 specific months ONLY) seems to me that was a specific batch of cards in the life cycle of a product sold since Dec 2013.
Not a particularly strong case, IMO, for in arguing that the machine has “known problems.”
Seems to me they temporarily got a bad batch of parts – and recalled the problem machines to fix it.
Just saying’
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
Fair enough.
It’s just puzzling to me because I’m fairly to VERY active on lots of FCP X boards internationally.
And melt down problems with X are simply not a thing you read about AT ALL in the FCP X world.
If it was an actual hardware design issue – and not some specific interaction between the hardware and the only program experiencing the issues – I’d be more interested.
Basically, if X can run “full out” on a trashcan without issues – and Premiere Pro can run fine as well under “normal circumstances” it just seems clear to me that the issue back then was them wasn’t hardware, but hardware/software interaction in a specific edge-case use.
Seems quite simple to me, but maybe I’m being unreasonable.
As I often say. I’m not a hardware guy. Just someone grateful that with a couple hundred delivered X programs under my belt, I haven’t had a single project over the past few years (even those with significant motion graphics, multi-cam and higher raster content) that have had problems outside those I’ve caused for myself via momentary personal stupidity.
Oh well.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
Well explained, Tony.
Sometimes it’s hard to break down and express this stuff because most of us just “do” our editing without thinking about it too much.
Time and again on my personal shift from Legacy style editing to X style editing – I’ve just realized that things that used to take me significant time to accomplish are suddenly NOT taking me anywhere near as much time.
Responding to client requests for changes are a HUGE area where I find this to be particularly true.
Concentrating on initially BUILDING a story will sometimes miss the impact. But when it comes time to CHANGE a story you’ll see it very clearly.
The thing is – once you learn that it can have a major influence on how you edit. When you see improvements that you can make to your work – the lower the “effort penalty” that’s applied to making those changes, the more likely you are to make them. You’re freer to simply take a chance to try something different.
Its a hidden benefit to having learned that the cost of “exploration” has been significantly decreased by the nature of the tool.
FWIW.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.