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Why is FCP so wimpy?
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I regularly online films as 1080 10 bit uncompressed, and I rarely have to render for most of my work.
Dissolves, titles, even lower thirds usually play in realtime. They may drop frames and play at half res while playing back for review, but I don’t care about review. To see full res, I can simply stop, scrub through, maybe render short sections.
We fully render timelines before exporting or layoff, though.
Arnie
Post production is not an afterthought!
https://www.arniepix.com/ -
What version of media100 are you using that you can’t have mixed file types in a time line Media100 was doing that before FCP. We switched to Final Cut because we switched to XSAN and Media100 doesn’t play well with XSAN.
Jim Calahan
KVIE, Sacramento -
I think what Olof points out here is one of FCP biggest problem and features today. As I’ve understood it Apple doesn’t want developers to tie FCP to dedicated hardware. Why I do somewhat ask my self but I do understand keeping it tied to software and general hardware is the way of the future. I think FCP is just lagging a bit behind…
The Next “Generation” of Final Cut Pro HOPEFULLY embraces the true “future” of computing at the moment looking at Snow Leopard…
– OpenCL and Grand Central for full use of the available GPU(s) and CPU’s in the system
– Full 64-bit for use of more memory and being able to push more throughput (and have better performance!)If only FCP was able to effectively use the power of the current systems I think we’d see a lot more RT and perhaps a lot more guaranteed RT. Also, if Apple moves to OpenCL the possibility is always there for custom solutions to again enter the market. These aren’t actually custom hardware for FCP, but general purpose high end GPU’s such as the nVidia Tesla that in theory could hook up to the OpenCL-system and accelerate stuff 100 fold to what we have today.
Personally I think this one of the biggest drawbacks with FCP today – high end realtime performance.
Erik Lindahl
Freecloud Communication
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[Erik Lindahl] “Personally I think this one of the biggest drawbacks with FCP today – high end realtime performance.
“That and the people willing to pay for it. I’m all for a CineWave type of card to come back and I’ll gladly pay $5,000 to get “Edit to Tape” realtime performance. But how many other people are willing to do this?
I think Apple thought they would be pulling out all sorts of realtime by now with CPU / GPU performance but it isn’t there. So we accept the fact that we have to render before outputting, but this is a welcome trade-off for the price we pay for the software.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post
Biscardi Creative MediaCreative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
Most, if not all, of the NLEs with dedicated hardware cards are unable to keep pace with changing technology, hence the reason so many users are dissatisfied and migrating to FCP rather than away from FCP. Plus, dedicated hardware is no longer necessary anyway — processor speeds are very fast, the number of onboard processors is scalable and virtually unlimited, and the amount of RAM is also essentially unlimited with the newest generations of computers that are coming down the pike soon.
One need only look at an app such as Autodesk Toxik to see what is possible today without hardware assist. Toxik was designed from the ground up to take advantage of 64-bit processing, multi-threading, and hyper-threading, and it can do 2K and 4K realtime playback with standard 8-core Windows and Macs right out of the box. And, contrary to the GPU processing that other companies have decided upon, Autodesk explored all of the possibilities, but decided against that route. With scalable processors and unlimited RAM coming our way, they have opted to let the computer itself do all the work. And, it does seem that this is the way of the future.
So, those of you who think that hardware cards for FCP are the key, and that they are in your future, better not hold your breath. But, keep in mind, it took years of R&D for Autodesk to discover their “holy grail” of performance. If Apple hasn’t been secretly on the job working to build FCP from the ground up, we’ll probably be in for a very long wait.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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[Jeremy Garchow] “I really wish Apple would ditch the studio and roll Motion and STP right into FCP.”
Oh man, I am so right there with you on this.
From one of my past posts:
“I can’t help but think that Apple’s whole Final Cut Studio strategy is driven by a marketing focus group rather than actual video professionals. It’s as if they believe that having more separate applications makes people think they’re getting more value for their money. In my opinion, all of the separate applications and need for round-tripping is extremely cumbersome and unnecessary when it’s easily possible to have a much tighter and more seamless integration of tools in fewer applications. I realize that FCP can’t be all things to all people, and that one application is rarely the solution to every problem, but I think Apple’s insistence on separating the tools so much is holding back the potential of the FCS suite. Adding a few of the most useful tools to FCP from other apps in the FCS suite would be a huge timesaver and help to streamline workflow.”
Taken from:
https://forums.creativecow.net/thread/8/1045063#1045063
I still think that Color should stay a standalone app, though.
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[David Roth Weiss] “But, keep in mind, it took years of R&D for Autodesk to discover their “holy grail” of performance.”
The real irony is that there apparently isn’t a large enough market for Autodesk to profit from keeping Toxik as a standalone product. Autodesk recently announced that Toxik is becoming “Maya Composite,” and it is now only available bundled it with Maya. All of that R&D money, and for what? A bundled companion product for Maya.
There must be a reason that Autodesk is doing this, and I’m sure that it simply comes down to money. There simply must not be a big enough market for a $3K compositor to justify its continued development as standalone application.
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[David Roth Weiss] “So, those of you who think that hardware cards for FCP are the key, and that they are in your future, better not hold your breath. “
DRW
I am going to take that challenge, because it depends on the work that you are doing.Yes I agree that many people do (will) not need output cards in the future, you will not need one for the plethora of internet content, nor for many of the non-broadcast uses like signage or displays.
but honestly
TODAY- You haven’t got a FRAKKIN’ clue.Today you cannot deliver to a national broadcaster without a hardware card.I know of no way to get content onto an HDSR Tape without a video card.
Dedicated hardware solutions are still more common than the final cut masses would even know of, since FCP started as a “prosumer” tool it was not taken seriously until 3-4 years after it came out. God look how long it took Apple to get TC working from anything other than firewire?
In the world of live events like Sports, News and Concerts all require hardware to achieve that process- we are going to throw all of the instantaneous content while we wait for a download from multiple cameras? what about switching between different camera positions? On Screen graphics, line and down markers all come generated out of hardware.
The single biggest jump in RED tech has been the RedRocket card, hands down the best mono-tasking tool in modern post, Only works with R3D files, but with a brute force that has not been seen out of the RED labs. For timely delivery in the RED world it is the only way to go whether you are working in FCP, Avid or something else.
Companies like Avid and Grass Valley still sell huge amounts of hardware for their production toolsets.
If Apple wants to expand what they are doing they are going to need to address some of these uses and tools, just like the other platforms.Without Video cards how does one confirm the quality of the output, correctly monitor output for 2K and larger frames, output to tape for broadcast or to film for the archival properties.
The best waveform and vectorscopes require baseband video signals, as do switchers and playout devices.Over 10 years people started saying that HD would be the death of Celluloid – yet it continues to be a widely used medium for acquisition as well as the single most permanent archive medium we can have for the foreseeable future. < the 3 strip B&W separation archives>
Different stokes for different folks, but it’s going to be long after I get out of the biz that technology will surpass my need for speed.
gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows for the Digitally Inclined
Chicago, ILhttps://library.creativecow.net/articles/adcock_gary/AJAIOHD.php
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[gary adcock] “Over 10 years people started saying that HD would be the death of Celluloid – yet it continues to be a widely used medium for acquisition as well as the single most permanent archive medium we can have for the foreseeable future. < the 3 strip B&W separation archives>
“Yeah and 3/4″ and VHS are totally dead but you know what, I’ve recently upconverted both formats for HD projects. I agree with you, hardware cards are a long way from going to pasture for those of us dealing with broadcast HD and higher delivery.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post
Biscardi Creative Media“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” now in Post.
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
Gary,
Of course, I too can list exceptions to everything. The needs of TV broadcasters for dedicated realtime hardware is still very pertinent. And yes, of course, Video I/O cards are clearly essential, basically for everyone, even those we hear from everyday here who don’t even know it. However, that wasn’t what the discussion was about, nor do I really care to argue about it. However, the trend in NLEs is, and will continue to be, more software running on more powerful computers, and fewer systems running dedicated hardware.
David
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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