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Transcoding to ProRes 422 LT for Optimised Media
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I think we need to think beyond a single disk drives worth of material here.
While LT plays a nice role in that as well, I am thinking about a server’s worth of material.
LT would make a huge difference in space savings, and with X being able to virtually flip resolution/ProRes variants on the flick of a virtual switch, it makes even more sense.
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[Andy Branner] “LOL… sure. Anyone with half a clue is going to be editing off the INTERNAL storage of their new Mac Pro. It’s so expensive that they can’t afford an extra disk for a hundred bucks and will have had to sell all the ones they already had. Gotcha. Just like I’m OF COURSE editing off the SSD in my new MBP because Apple pushed it on me. Not the least bit contrived.”
Andy, just a couple threads up, you’re reminding us that editors will be getting footage from iPads, not just Alexas as F55s. Given that, why do think it’s beyond the realm of plausibility that someone might want to cut on their internal flash storage? I think we will actually see a lot of this. A Promise RAID is nice, but why carry it if you don’t have to?
And just a few threads down, you were all excited about how fast that flash storage is — but now you don’t want to use it for media?
And this is just one scenario where LT might be preferred. A 30% savings in disk space is nothing to sneeze at in larger storage systems, either, where you cannot simply add 1 TB of storage for $40 as you keep suggesting.
[Andy Branner] “YOU CAN. If it’s actually somehow THAT essential to you, set your project to HQ or 4×4 and work with the native files or just plain transcode prior to import! Sheesh… funny how that didn’t seem to be a burden or “totally unprofessional” for any and every FCP and Avid user for the last 10-20 years.”
Seriously, stop with the strawmen. You keep attributing this perspective to me, but I do not hold it.
I’m not calling it a burden, and I’m not calling it totally unprofessional, I’m just saying it sure would be a nice feature for FCPX to support multiple flavors of ProRes as automatically optimized media.
In general, I think that professional applications like FCPX should offer as much flexibility to their users as is practical. This is not a case of balancing flexibility against complexity. We’re talking about adding a dropdown menu of ProRes profiles next to the “Create optimized media” checkbox, with ProRes 422 left as the sensible default.
Have to have? Certainly not. Nice to have? Yes, I think so.
Overall, I’m really disappointed with the aggressive view expressed in this thread that ProRes 422 is the ideal mix of quality and bitrate, no one should want or need another option. It used to be that others’ workflow needs were considered and respected here. Jumping to conclusions about how our fellow professionals should be working without learning about their needs is just as narrow-minded as rejecting FCPX without learning about its capabilities.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Walter Soyka] “A significant difference between ProRes and ProRes Proxy with FCPX is that the resolution of proxies is halved in both dimensions, so it’s not suitable for full-res output”
[Andy Branner] “When and where did anyone even suggest that?”
So needlessly argumentative. My remark above was in response to Bill:
[Bill Davis] “it’s arguable that if you want drive space savings, Proxy functionally looks virtually as good in practical operation as native file editing. So why go half way?”
The ability to use LT for full-res output while still saving over ProRes 422 is the reason to go halfway.
Again, not a choice that I would necessarily make for myself right now, but I can see why others might want this.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Jeremy Garchow] “While LT plays a nice role in that as well, I am thinking about a server’s worth of material.
LT would make a huge difference in space savings, and with X being able to virtually flip resolution/ProRes variants on the flick of a virtual switch, it makes even more sense.
“That’s precisely why LT was used instead of regular ProRes at a facility I used to work at. They generated about 1-2 TBs of new video each week (95% in ProRes LT or XDCAM EX) and space was always at a premium on the Xsan (which was ‘only’ 60TB). Adding space wasn’t cheap nor easy and regular Pro Res wasn’t an option because of the file size. It wasn’t until ProRes LT came out that they were able to move away from DVCProHD as their default codec. Acquire, edit, basic color grade and deliver (web and broadcast). LT has worked great for them for a number of years.
I’m not sure why LT has a rep for being lousy codec when the quality is so much better than the vast majority of acquisition codecs out there. If you have long-gop camera masters you want to put into an easier to edit, fairly universal codec I think LT is a great option. Is regular ProRes better? Sure. But HQ is better than that. And 4444 is even better than HQ. At some point deadlines, budget, equipment etc., all come into play when determining workflows.
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[Andy Branner] “Sure Walter. Let’s go duplicitously straight for the Promise RAIDs and act like even a 2.5″ USB 3 disk wouldn’t be more than enough for your 8 hours of LT, just to build yet another straw man.”
That’s fair. A little external disk would do fine.
[Andy Branner] “Again… go for the feedback page or simply wait and see! Pretty simple concept. I’M not the one you need to convince of this “necessity”. “
In your first post in this thread, you said that “more flexible transcoding options would be nice.” I’m not trying to convince you of this, because I understand that we actually agree.
[Andy Branner] “But fact of the matter is, X plays to a huge and entirely different crowd than your idea of pros (that I’ve been so flagrantly dissing).”
Please enlighten me as to what my idea of “pro” is.
[Andy Branner] “Too bad I never actually said that either. But contrive away. Again… used to it.”
I never said you did. I was addressing the thread overall — which is why I used the word “overall.”
[Andy Branner] “I, with others, merely stated that *I* don’t need it and completely understand Apple’s reasoning and logic on the subject and agree.”
What exactly is that reasoning and logic? That a single hard-coded configuration is better than a few options for those who care with a sensible default for those who don’t?
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Adam White] “But I don’t understand why it’s such a big deal to ask for a simple transcode option to be added, and why some people seem so dead against it. LT works great. I understand not everyone will want to use it, but for those that it works well for, why deprive them of the option? “
Its not a big deal. Its a very fair request to make. And, its certainly a fair and interesting point for discussion here on this board. Any rudeness or anger you are experiencing has nothing to do with you or your questions.
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[Chris Harlan] “Its not a big deal. Its a very fair request to make. And, its certainly a fair and interesting point for discussion here on this board. Any rudeness or anger you are experiencing has nothing to do with you or your questions.”
Well said!
Steve Connor
There’s nothing we can’t argue about on the FCPX COW Forum
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Weren’t you arguing for a large portion of an earlier thread about how blazingly fast the speeds were from the Flash storage on the new Mac pro and that PC’s were yesterdays news because they didn’t have this? If someone with only half a clue would edit with an internal drive and Pegasus TB Raids are overkill, what is an optimum way to work?
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Do you talk to people in the same way that you type forum messages?
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Can I take a guess that English is your second language?
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