So who is the best candidate?

[Ivan Radovanovic]

Hi Adam,

– No, AMA is Avid Media Access. You can read more about it here: https://www.avid.com/US/products/Avid-Media-Access
But as I said previously AMA still doesn’t work so good as native editing in Premiere
– Premiere media management is not that bad, but nothing beats Avid. People often say that Avid is database with NLE capabilities 🙂
– In Avid you still have to transcode for optimal workflow. Transcode everything, and is sometimes time consuming (honestly I don’t believe that is the right path for file based workflows, and that will probably change with 64bit MC6). Basically that works this way: You use AMA to get your native clips into bins and than transcode selection within MC. It would be best for you to download MC trial and do some tests: https://forms.avid.com/forms/mctrial
In Premiere I have tried Red, HDSLR h264, AVCHD, AVC INTRA, File sequence, everything works.
– Finishing ….. Definitely that won’t be easy as “send to Color” (although even for that one you should take care how you prepare your sequence).
First you have to check what formats your CC suite supports (Resolve for example).
Basically it comes down to this:
A) If Resolve supports your native format:
– In Premiere edit native, export EDL, import into Resolve and connect to original files
– In Avid, AMA to original files, transcode selection, edit, reconnect to original files, export EDL, conform in Resolve
B) If Resolve doesn’t support your native format:
– In Premiere edit native, render out (Uncompressed, what ever), export EDL, import baked clip into Resolve, create cut list from EDL
– In Avid, AMA to original files, transcode selection to higher quality DNxHD MXFs, export EDL, buy Avid MFX option for Resolve, conform.
* Note that everything I wrote above is a bit simplified, but that’s how it goes.
* In any case you’ll be working with 15-20 minutes reels. But I suppose that you already know that.
* If you can afford/rent Avid DS, I would always consider finishing Avid projects in DS (even with not so great CC tools).

[Dennis Radeke]

David did a good job of discussing Premiere Pro’s fresh code base and the effort that goes into a re-write – it really becomes a new product. The difference obviously lies in the fact that Adobe did not radically change the editing paradigm as Apple has done.

To speak to your concern, I think that Adobe has as good or better of an ecosystem than Apple does. Certainly with things like After Effects our plugin compatibility is greater than anyone else out there and all of the big guys (Red Giant for example) make their hosts compatible with both Premiere Pro and After Effects whenever possible.

For other hardware partners, we work with all three of the major video i/o vendors for the Mac, hang off of the same storage as anyone else (including Avid’s ISIS) and are now growing increasingly cozy with broadcast centric, high-end solutions such as Harmonic Media Grid and several others.

We publish a robust SDK (software development kit) so anyone can build support for our products – just search ‘Premiere Pro SDK’ and you’ll find it easily enough. That’s a big difference next to some of my competition – easy access to develop support for a given product.

Lastly, we’re working with some partners in ways that gives us terrific performance, namely nvidia. The CUDA architecture, while not ‘open’ like OpenCL, is actually ready today and working. In speaking to a major plugin vendor this week, he said that OpenCL still isn’t ready…

Hope this helps give you confidence about Adobe’s ecosystem as well.

Cheers,
Dennis – Adobe

[Adam Claude jones]

Thanks Ivan.

So in Avid you need to transcode everything? Even XDCAM EX and Canon 5D?
And how is the DPX workflow in Avid? I didn’t find much online.
Let’s say I have a DPX sequence that must be edited, then sent to compositing in Nuke and then sent back to Avid for finishing editing and then sent to Resolve for grade and in this DPX project I have a few shots in XDCAM EX and Canon 5D. How would that go? This would be a normal project for me.

[Ivan Radovanovic]

Let say there won’t be any offline-online workflow here, just to make things easier.
You can access XDCAM and Canon H264 files via AMA. In other words you can import them into Avid bins and work with them, but that won’t run so good (especially H264). So after import you should make selection (clips, subclips, what ever) and transcode to Avid DNxHD MFX.
For DPX you will use Avid Metafuze. Free Avid application that runs on Win & Linux (no OS X). Metafuze will convert DPX sequences to AVID MXFs and keep the metadata https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlsdh_d0mOI
Edit with mxf files.
Export tiff sequence for Nuke
Bring back VFX sequence into Avid
Lock your edit
From here you have some different paths to CC suite:
A) Export EDL, purchase $500 MXF option for BM Davinci Resolve and conform Avid MFX files in Resolve
B) Export EDL, “bake” export your sequence, create cut list with EDL in Resolve
C) Reconnect original media ….
Again, I’m oversimplifying explanation here but I hope you’ll get the picture how it works.

In Premiere you would import XDCAM, H264 and DPX original files and edit right away.

You can download trials for the both applications (you don’t have to purchase via App Store just to try it out 🙂 ) and test some workflows yourself.

[Jim Wiseman]

You really should check out the new Media 100 Suite. All Mac. XML in and out of Color, Resolve, FCP 7. Seamless to and from AE. Red raw support to 4k. And solid as a rock. Supports AJA boards. Easy learning curve. Free 14 day free trial. media100.com

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 1.7.1, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz, Macbook Pro Core2Duo, G5 Quadcore PCIe, Media 100i/XR

[Adam Claude jones]

Thanks for the detailed explanation Ivan. Very kind of you.
I still have a couple of questions about it bellow and would appreciate your help with them. Thanks in advance.

You can access XDCAM and Canon H264 files via AMA. In other words you can import them into Avid bins and work with them, but that won’t run so good (especially H264).

So I can work with XDCAM and H264 natively but it is buggy? What kind of problems are we talking about here?

So after import you should make selection (clips, subclips, what ever) and transcode to Avid DNxHD MFX.

Ok. But am I lossing anything by transcoding to DNxHD? Probably not but I just want to make sure. In the end of the day it is still a generational lost though.

For DPX you will use Avid Metafuze. Free Avid application that runs on Win & Linux (no OS X).

So that won’t work on a Mac? I wonder if it will cause any problems for grading in Resolve on the Mac?
I absolutely need DPX and I absolutely need Resolve on the Mac. For DPX in Avid I need Windows. To grade these same DPX in Resolve I need a Mac. Resolve on Linux is out of my range.
Trouble?

Metafuze will convert DPX sequences to AVID MXFs and keep the metadata

It will keep the metadata but will it still be uncompressed? Or will it compress the files making me lose quality? I’m thinking MXF may be a wrapper here but wanted to make sure.

Edit with mxf files.
Export tiff sequence for Nuke

Can I also export DPX instead?

Bring back VFX sequence into Avid
Lock your edit
From here you have some different paths to CC suite:
A) Export EDL, purchase $500 MXF option for BM Davinci Resolve and conform Avid MFX files in Resolve

Can’t I go the DPX way? Or maybe TIFF (if Resolve works on TIFFs)? Must it be MXF?

B) Export EDL, “bake” export your sequence, create cut list with EDL in Resolve

Not sure i understood it here. 🙁

C) Reconnect original media ….
Again, I’m oversimplifying explanation here but I hope you’ll get the picture how it works.

Thanks for the explanation. It was very helpful. Although I do have a couple of questions about it. 🙂

In Premiere you would import XDCAM, H264 and DPX original files and edit right away.

Man, Premiere is looking more handy and less work. I guess Avid is still lagging behind in some aspects. What was more attractive in FCP than Avid was because I had the impression Avid was always either lagging behind or holding back.

You can download trials for the both applications (you don’t have to purchase via App Store just to try it out 🙂 ) and test some workflows yourself.

Yep. I just want to narrow down to one first so I can try that first and if it works for me I just stick with it.

Thanks again Ivan.

[Adam Claude jones]

Thanks. I will check it out. How does it handle DPX sequences? How about XDCAM EX and 5D H264?

Thanks.

[Ivan Radovanovic]

– AMA is not buggy but you won’t get legendary Avid realtime performance (especially with h264). Probably that will change with 64bit MC6
– Transcoding to DNxHD is basically the same as transcoding to ProRes. Both codecs are visually lossless, but not mathematically lossless.
– Metafuze is not trouble, you’ll just have to use emulator or another Win/Lin machine.
– Other questions requires much, much longer explanation.
Bottom line – if you want fast transition from FCP, Premiere is the right choice.