-
Should I still charge a kill fee in this instance?
-
[Tim Wilson] “If you haven’t told ’em up front that you’ll charge them if they hold you up, and they haven’t agreed to it in advance, in writing, you’re stuck.”
In a recent recording session that I had booked at a friend’s studio, the artist I was going to work with called me a couple of days before the date and canceled due to illness. I then called the studio and told him that I was going to cancel the date and that I knew it was late enough that I doubted he could reschedule anyone at so close a time, that I would send him $200 for the cancellation. He thanked me and I kept the goodwill that I have earned with him over the years.
He would have likely let me go without a charge but it is important to be to be one of his good clients, not one of the ones that he can’t rely on.
Ron Lindeboom
-
If this new client is truly the “big name” that Evan mentioned in the original post, they probably expect to be charged. However, human nature being what it is, you just never know how people are going to respond where money is concerned.
However, as I mentioned in the initial response above in this thread, there are ways of asking a client face to face without incurring any ill will — it’s all in the delivery, and eventually everyone in this business needs to learn to how to be very direct without pushing any buttons. However, if you feel you can’t deliver the line in a way guarantees a positive outcome, then by all means, either follow Tim’s advice or the advice of others who suggest that you include it on your invoice, but with a big N/C (that’s no charge) on that line.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
-
This comes down to how you do business. This has been discussed countless times here. Do you charge by the hour, by the day or by the project? That determines everything. If you book your time as a button pusher then an hour spent not working is not billing and you get more stress than you really need. If you charge by the project, you charge enough that the client can work on their schedule and you are compensated enough to not worry about cancellations. If a client cancels on me, I get to spend that time doing something for myself (learning), for my business (marketing) or for another customer who will be happy to see their next deliverable a day sooner.
If you are charging enough for your work, nickel and diming does not come into the picture. If clients nickel and dime you that’s another story.
Mike Cohen -
[Mike Cohen] “If you charge by the project, you charge enough that the client can work on their schedule and you are compensated enough to not worry about cancellations.
If a client cancels on me, I get to spend that time doing something for myself (learning), for my business (marketing) or for another customer who will be happy to see their next deliverable a day sooner.”
I added some boldface to Mike’s quote because it nailed my own view on this.
1) The only clients of mine who charged hourly were lawyers, and they KNEW they were constantly angling. Talking on the phone while driving allowed them to charge twice for the same minutes. Their clients might not have witnessed this double billing, but every one of them understood that incremental billing always worked in the lawyer’s favor.
Other than them, none of my clients earned their own livings hourly. None of their secretaries got paid hourly. Their electricians and dock hands were all on salary. Even waiters worked on tips, not unlike the commission that their salespeople worked on. The only people in their sphere who worked hourly were the cleaning staff and temps.
Shifting away from hourly billing completely changed the dynamic of my client relationships. It established that I wasn’t a hireling. Working as one professional to another, I found that the client tried harder to keep up their end of the deal. Work got done more quickly, with fewer hassles.
b) I thought of cancellations kind of like snow days. You still have to go to school for the same number of days, but an unexpected cancellation FEELS like a vacation….even if there’s a ton of stuff to do.
My top things to do during cancellations, in order: banking/post office/shopping; chatting up/buying lunch for prospects; working on my tan. Downtime can be your friend.
Third, no first-time clients got any grief for me for anything. We have no relationship yet. The project hadn’t begun.
And once the relationship/project got started, there was no upside in being the one to turn the thing into a line-item hassle.
Why? Because once you start line-iteming, incrementalizing, minutely detailing your billing, you give them permission to do the exact same thing back to you.
In other words, the level of detail of your billing is directly proportional to the number of things they get to argue with you about.
Don’t open this door if you don’t want to go allllll the way through it.
-
Tons of great posts here.
Evan, I know your gig has since past and you have dealt with the situation as you saw fit. The thing that really sucks about your situation is the fact that they called an hour before the edit.
When a new client calls about a freelance edit job, I send them my rate card which gives them an idea of what to expect, including my cancellation fee. I would (and have) broken this rule for new clients. If an existing customer cancels with short notice and wants me to wave the fee we negotiate. I understand they have budgets to deal with, and am willing to give them a pass for another edit in the next week or two.
Most people are very understanding – cancellation fees are a common industry practice. How you handle them decides how your long-term relationship develops. I have worked with some of the same people and companies for over 15 years and each understands how the money works.
[Tim Wilson] “no first-time clients got any grief from me for anything. We have no relationship yet. The project hadn’t begun.”
Tim, totally agree, but…
[Tim Wilson] “Not that you can’t mention it, but frankly, I wouldn’t. In similar situations, I didn’t. If they really are big, and you really do hope to work for them for a long time, take the money, and get used to be being pushed around. It stinks, but this is why they call it work.”
…I totally disagree. Just because a company is big doesn’t mean they have ANY right to push me around. If the people who are hiring me want to work that way, forget it. My time is better spent elsewhere, no matter how big they are. (And I work with many of these Fortune 50 companies.)
If you “get used to be being pushed around” now, that is how they will always view you. Let them know your policies and expectations. You’ll be expected to fulfill their company expectations, they should do the same for you and your company.
Ed
Avid and FCP Preditor
_________________________________________________
Anything worth doing at all, is worth doing well.
– Philip Dormer Stanhope, Earl of Chesterfield -
Final update: I waived the fee, and stated I need 24 hours advanced notice for a booking going forward. If I’m put on hold, there is no fee if the client releases me.
This thread has been very insightful to say the least. It’s great to get many perspectives on this matter, and see what works for some folks and why it doesn’t for others, and see what I can apply to my business. Thanks all.
-
Out of curiosity –
Does anyone have a policy that if you, as the editor, has to cancel on the client an hour before the edit session, you’d make up the time for them? (explicitly stated or as goodwill)
Is the same argument made for giving them a freebie session?
D
Dan Schanler
NYC -
– In other words, the level of detail of your billing is directly proportional to the number of things they get to argue with you about.-
Yet another Tim Wilson quote that deserves a place in bronze.
-
Great question. “Turnabout is fair play,” I guess.
When a client cancels late on me, I do not charge a cancellation fee if it’s an “act of God,” or even a human slip-up, in part because of the situation that Dan describes: what if I couldn’t fulfill an obligation due to circumstances beyond my control?
If a client develops a regular habit (due to something other than acts of God) of booking a Wednesday, and not really being ready until Friday, then it’s time for Plan B. Explain to the client the difference between ink and pencil, i.e. a firm booking vs. a tentative one. If Client 1 asks you to “pencil them in,” that means that if Client 2 offers you a job, you can call Client 1, let them know you have a firm offer from another client, and give Client 1 a choice: either release you from the session OR “ink them in,” meaning that they must pay for the day, whether they show up or not. I think that makes it more understandable to the client, that if they reserve the time and deprive you of the opportunity to do another job, you must be compensated for the loss. In time, that tends to make clients more responsible about their bookings.
Plan B is more of an educational tool than a money-maker. In fact, as a revenue-producer, it is a loser. I have raised the CONCEPT of Plan B quite often, giving Client 1 the chance to reschedule or book firmly, but only once have enforced it when Client 1 couldn’t make the date (losing Client 1 in the process). But I got paid, and it was one of the happiest working days of my life.
Bob C
Reply to this Discussion! Login or Sign Up