SAN for FCP?

[Bernard Lamborelle]

When comparing MetaSAN/MetaLAN to a Server/Client model, one should think of MetaSAN as the server portion, and MetaLAN the client.

MetaSAN workstations need a direct access to the shared storage (typically using either Fibre Channel, iSCSI, or InfiniBand), while MetaLAN clients always access the shared storage through a MetaSAN server that acts as a gateway.

However, unlike a regular network connection, MetaLAN mounts a logical volume (as oppose to a network share). It also provides block-level access (similar to iSCSI), and bandwidth control that enable one to limit or reserve the number of streams one can play out of any given workstation (this feature is also referred to as Quality-of-Service or “throttling”).

Using MetaSAN/MetaLAN, one can deploy a wide variety of workgroup topologies to accommodate multiple workflows and budget – from affordable DV editing all the way up to 2K uncompressed film workflows.

For example, you can have one MetaSAN workstation (with direct-attach storage) feeding a dozen or so MetaLAN clients doing DV editing over a Gigabit Ethernet network. However, those doing uncompressed SD or HD work would typically have a bunch of MetaSAN workstations connected to a shared storage via Fibre Channel.

However, the solution really shines in a combined topology with a mix of Fibre Channel and Ethernet: Instead of connecting to a specific server (like clients do with normal network shares), MetaLAN clients connect to a

[Jeff Bernstein]

As if what Bernard said was not enough, they even have outstanding support!

Jeff Bernstein

Digital Desktop Consulting
Apple Pro Video VAR
XSAN Certified

323-653-7611

[John Buck]

jeff
can you email me off list please
have a quick q

john
http://www.velocite.net

[Jeff Bernstein]

John,

I will need your email address. It is not listed in your profile.

Jeff

[Allan White]

There’s some great points in this thread here. I just purchased a 3-seat MetaSAN license, with some MetaLAN ethernet clients (read rest of thread). It’s working well, and Bernard was a huge help. =)

However, I do think that Terrablock has a great product (that seems well reviewed), and were I a really small shop or editor that just wanted a plug-and-play solution, I would look hard at the Terrablock solution.

To design and implement my shared storage for my 3-workstation group, I had to do a TON of learning & research as an editor: storage RAID sets, understanding Fibre Channel, SANs, volumes, LUNs, HBA’s, cabling, connectors, dos and don’ts, and more. This is why SAN consultants are probably worth their weight in salt! I think of the hours spent… at least I know how it works, right?

I also had other requirements that led me to MetaSAN (namely: price of the LAN licenses is a steal) and there were other things I wanted our server to do. But, if simplicity is the goal, Terrablock has a strong offering.

[Mark Raudonis]

[David Jahns] “So far, my impression of XSAN is that it’s horribly complicated and fragile – we do not have a dedicated IT person, but I think we would need one if we got an XSAN.”

David,

This isn’t necessarily true. We’re operating a fairly large x-SAN (100 seats) and we do NOT have a dedicated IT person managing this. Sure we have an IT guy for all of our email, word and PC’s, but he doesn’t touch the X-SAN. Our assistant editor teams manage it.

I certainly can understand why a reseller would characterize X-SAN as such (they want to sell you something else) but I’m here to tell you it ain’t true. All of the solutions discussed above will work, but you have to ask how well do they scale up? You’re gonna hit a wall both in storage and number a systems on one of these “SAN in a can” solutions way before X-SAN. I’m not saying that X-SAN is the right solution for you, but I can’t let a statement like you made above go unchallenged. We’ve been operating X-SAN for over three years now in an extremely demanding environment with results quite comparable to Avid’s Unity. In fact, for almost a year we had Unity and X-SAN operating side by side. Based on that experience I can confidently say that X-SAN will offer you the most comparable networked workflow features.

Mark

PS. I’m not a reseller, I’m an end user.

[David Jahns]

thanks for your comments, Mark. It’s good to hear from a happy XSAN user. My impressions were based on Apple’s touring dog & pony show, as well as hearing some first hand experiences from people with small systems.

Whereas the Unity admin tool is quite simple & easy to use for basic workspace management, the XSAN admin process seemed MUCH more complicated, and difficut to grasp right away.

And I attended a workshop at NAB 06 where a guy that has a 4 seat XSAN said he does about 10-15 hours of XSAN admin every week. And I know the post house in LA that cut the Zodiac/Fincher film on FCP – everything went smooth for them, but they have a full time IT genius that was literally writing UNIX code patches to solve their workflow issues.

But it sounds like you guys have a pretty smooth setup there. Do you mind if I ask who your XSAN vendor/designer is?

[Keicol]

Bernard,

I have been happy with my Metasan system. I added a Mac pro to the mix. Everything was fine except that when the Mac Pro was disconnected from the system it would have problems shutting down, I would have to do a hard shutdown to turn it off. Tonight after I pulled the Mac Pro from the system to replace some Ram it again had problems shutting down and I just figured that was because it was on the bench away from the SAN. I finished adding ram and then brought it back to the rack wired it back in, started the entire san starting the Mac Pro system first so it’d be the master as I usually have done and everything worked fine. At the end of the session I shut everything down as usual (master last) and all seemed fine until I returned back to work and fired up the system again (Mac Pro first), it failed to see the shared storage, none of the clients could either, no matter which system I booted first to become master. Before Metasan if I had a directory problem I could use Disk Warrior but now with the san protection, Disk Warrior sees the disconected raid as an unknown disk. Is there anyway to remove the protection or is there a way to remove Metasan from the host and still be able to connect it to the raid? I would connect just one computer at a time, just in case Disk Warrior might see the drive to repair it. I never had any of these problems when I was just running G5s, the Mac Pro has been problamatic when running Metasan, when Metasan is removed it’ll boot and shutdown when unconnected to the san just as it’s supposed to.

What else might you suggest I try to save my raid?

Thanks, Keith

[Mark Raudonis]

[David Jahns] “a guy that has a 4 seat XSAN said he does about 10-15 hours of XSAN”

What? You’re kidding, right? That is just insane! We’ve been operating for three years and I swear in all that time I’ve NEVER spent that amount of time per week on admin issues. Yes, we have had periods of upgrades, moving equipment and things like that, but day to day, I would be surprised if we spend more than an hour a week! Really! This is for a 50 terrabyte system with almost a hundred users. Mixed resolutions, PC/ mac environment, broadcast deadlines every week.

It sounds like your “friend” has nothing better to do or is trying to justify his job. I’ve got plenty of other responsibilities at the company and if I had to spend that kind of time, I just wouldn’t get anything else done.

This is why I feel compelled to comment about X-SAN. There’s a ton of misinformation or NO information about how it really works. Yes, it requires alot of arcane “networking” info to set it up, but once you’ve done the install properly, it’s very stable.

As for who’s our reseller/engineer? We did it ourselves. From the very begining (beta version) we recognized that X-SAN hit the sweet spot for what we needed. At the time there were no resellers so we just dug in and figured it out. Apple helped us a bit in the very begining, but that was because there wasn’t even a manual printed yet.

My advice for anyone considering X-SAN today is to find a good reseller and contract them for the installation plus a “hand holding” period immediately after. That way, you can be assured it’s going to work and they can help you design your workflow and media management. In my experience, the hardware either works or it doesn’t. That can be handled immediately. Developing a good workflow that takes advantage of X-SAN’s strengths (Distributed rendering for compressor!) is going to take some expert assistance.

Good luck.

Mark

[David Jahns]

Thanks for the advice, Mark.

We’ve been pretty happy with ProMax in Irvine, CA as a vendor for our FCP edit systems, and they have set up many XSANs around the country.

Does anyone else out there have an XSAN vendor or SAN consultant to recommend?