macbook air and fcpx- the new portable edit suite

[Timothy Auld]

And just by the way, tuning is a very personal pursuit.

bigpine

[Simon Ubsdell]

Thanks, David. Someone has finally articulated perfectly my own workflow as regards audio – or rather has pointed out that for some forms of editing there can be no separation between the video and the audio processes.

As someone who works equally in sound and picture, I can say that DAWs are not going to be adopting a trackless model any time soon (please let this be true!!!!) – so many fundamental mixing processes depend on the track paradigm that any attempt to change this would be substantially more disruptive (to say the very least) than what has happened with FCPX and video editing.

Simon Ubsdell
Director/Editor/Writer
http://www.tokyo-uk.com

[Craig Seeman]

I noted in another response to Timothy, intonation has changed over the last few hundred years and certainly there are musical instruments and systems of composition that require different notation.

Conventions themselves have changed and it is true that some are niche but some are major. Intonation has changed and the same note on a sheet of paper in 1500 may not actually be the same tuning today.

Both Brian Eno and Philip Glass get work scoring film/video.
One can only imagine what the score of Forbidden Planet looked like (by Louis & Bebe Barron).

The real question is that can different methods of tuning and notation and sound creation tell a story conventionally understood (lets not talk about non conventions).

FCPX may start a new convention or just be a niche (only time will tell) but can you use it to tell the story you want to tell and can people viewing that story understand it? I’d say yes.

[Craig Seeman]

[TImothy Auld] “And point me toward any scholarly discussion about chamber music or any other kind of music that diverges significantly from current (and I mean right now) music notation.”

https://www.the-compound.org/writing/classicaltuning.pdf

https://www.piano-tuners.org/edfoote/index.html

https://cnx.org/content/m11639/latest/

Tunings have changed over time and there are tunings based on culture (types of music).
An “A#” may have been very different and the relationship between the notes which impact both the sound melody and chordal movement have changed.

To even assume there is “one standard” is very “western”
The notes meaning to a European orchestra might mean something different to that hundreds of years ago, may vary by region and may vary radically by culture.

And notation itself has changed
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baroque_music
During the period, composers and performers used more elaborate musical ornamentation, made changes in musical notation, and developed new instrumental playing techniques.

and
https://www.jstor.org/pss/1571989

If fact that may be the very root of the problem in that FCPX is breaking with a “tradition” that is only very recent and is absolutely not immune to change.

[David Lawrence]

[Jeremy Garchow] “And for those that are still paying attention to the subject line, how does the Macbook Air portability factor fit in to your backpack factor, factually? Discuss.”

Hey All,

I’ve started another thread where we can continue this discussion and be on topic 😉

Please join me here:

NLEs, DAWs, Tracks and Audio-centric Workflows — Continuing the Conversation…

I’ll be quoting from this thread as needed. Looking forward to getting deeper into the many interesting questions and points we’re discussing.

_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl

[Jeremy Garchow]

[TImothy Auld] “You responded to something way down a thread. But if you don’t get it by now then music has had conventions for a thousand years. Any musician understands them. No one is changing them. No one has changed them for a very long time. What part of that do you not understand?”

I guess I just don’t get what you are trying to say, and for that I apologize. All I get from it is that music conventions haven’t changed in 1000 years, and no one wants to change them. I can’t believe that and would doubt that it’s true, but I don’t have the exact knowledge to back it up. Unfortunately, I’m the loser.

Can I ask, what about electronic music (no instruments), and the musicians that create it? Do you think that might have an effect on musical conventions?

This started by a question I asked to David Lawrence, that I have edited here:

Also, do you think that this style of editing is simply impossible in FCPXs timeline?

[Herb Sevush]

From the point at which well tempered tuning was established, back in Bach’s days, I am not aware of any sudden changes in orchestral playing. Intonation has evolved slowly. Tim’s point was not that music and musical instruments haven’t changed, but that an oboist in Paris in 1840 could sit down in a recording session in LA today, look at a sheet of music, and play along with a bunch of modern musicians because of a shared set of conventions. Yes there have been changes in music since then – that same player would be lost playing with Brian Eno, the Ramones, or Miles Davis (especially Miles because he’s quite dead.) However he could get by in most situations because our music notation is still based on those ancient European conventions.

This is about the value of shared conventions and the inefficiency of changing them.

Back to car analogies – It doesn’t really matter whether you drive on the right side or the left, as long as your going in the same pattern as everyone else. The inefficiency of sudden change can really be felt the first time you rent a car in England and take it for a spin. So the question is whether the value received for breaking these conventions is worth the inefficiency of the change.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions

[Craig Seeman]

[Herb Sevush] “an oboist in Paris in 1840 could sit down in a recording session in LA today, look at a sheet of music, and play along with a bunch of modern musicians because of a shared set of conventions.”

And an Avid Media Composer editor from 1989 could sit in front of a Media Composer in 2011 and get comfortably pretty quickly as well. That can even describe me (used MC from 1989-2001) but if the same editor sat in front of the new instrument with new conventions (FCPX) they might find it easier to tell a story (in this case that would be me as well). I may well chose to be fluent in the new instrument.

I see no reason to be stuck in a convention which actually is still new enough to undergo radical changes.

[Herb Sevush] “This is about the value of shared conventions and the inefficiency of changing them. “

I may find the new way of doing things more efficient even if others don’t.

If you’re talking about simultaneous collaborative effort, such as musicians playing together, I may just the best collaborative instrument because convention may be important. If I’m a soloist in front of an instrument or NLE, the choice is mine.

If I choose to play the base with a traditional base guitar or a Chapman Stick and the base is conveyed to the listener than that’s my choice of instrument.

As FCPX improves it’s collaborative abilities then the choice of instrument is not an issue as long as the sound is achieved.

Some people are uncomfortable moving outside of convention and others aren’t. There’s no reason for FCPX to use the same conventions as Avid and Premiere (and others) if one feels they can play FCPX better.

The story told is the convention, the instrument played is wide open. XML is a notation and it seems third parties are willing to work the FCPX’s notation.

[Herb Sevush]

If you see yourself as a soloist and you like the way FCPX works, it is indeed a good match. I don’t see myself as a soloist however, I often play in an ensemble in which new members often sit in at a moment’s notice. In my setting, shared conventions help.

For me it’s about financial efficiency. When X comes out with multi-cam and if it’s implementation of it seems more valuable to me than the inefficiency of it’s iconoclasm, then I’m not too hidebound to switch.

Multi-cam seems to me a perfect use of the metadata strength of X so I’m curious to see what they come up with.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions

[Craig Seeman]

[Herb Sevush] “I often play in an ensemble in which new members often sit in at a moment’s notice. In my setting, shared conventions help.”

My clients are more concerned with my output. They’d primarily focus on my output monitor (well they will when Apple does that early next year).

Sound and Colorists would only be concerned with being able to read my XML. That’s going to happen very quickly now that Apple has included that. SAN support is a start for facility use.

So who else has to care about what I sit in front. They may care if I can deliver faster. I care if I can get done an hour earlier.