General Lag, Waveform Showstopper

[Steve Connor]

Really hoping for some speed increases in the way FCPX handles waveforms & thumbnails in the next release. PPro CC 2014 can also take a while to generate the waveform and thumbnail data, but once it’s in then it’s much faster on my machine.

It’s not enough of an issue to stop me using FCPX but it’s the one thing I wish they would improve.

[Bill Davis]

[Chris Frantz] “Wait you’re kiddibg, you’re waiting overnight to start working because of waveform rendering? How do you bill your client for that wasted day? I can take these same files into FCP7 and Premiere, with the same sequence settings and they work fine.”

Just so we’re clear, millions of people cut everyday in X and don’t have to wait for anything. We’re trying to address a particular use case where the OP is seeing waveform generation delays. These happen in ALL NLEs. For many reasons. Perhaps it’s the nature of the original files verses the storyline settings that’s causing something to have to do a long transcode. As a general example, I’ve had SD work take LONGER to process than HD work. Could NOT figure out why. Then I realized that the source footage was HD and to “dumb it down” at little as possible, every large raster frame had to process into being a smaller raster frame before X could bring it into edit on an SD storyline. Is that a flaw? Or is trying to do the best possible mathematical job of shoehorning 1920 x 1080 pixels into a 640 x 480 gird something you might VALUE as a producer?

Judging any NLE based on reading stuff in a forum where people come to fix their unusual problems is always a suspect strategy IMO. And that includes those who judge AVID or Premier in the same way.

Basically, it’s the dermatologist problem. No matter how handsome the subject, if all you do is spend all day with a magnifying glass staring at it’s blemishes and flaws, then you are NOT getting the total effect of the subject.

FWIW

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.

[Chris Frantz]

I realize you’re a staunch defender of this software, but please realize I and others (even in this very thread) have said this is indeed a problem. I don’t think it’s from looking too closely at the problem, more like it’s unable to do the work that other NLE’s can do, including it’s older counterpart. This isn’t a matter of sequence settings, or problems with QC’d source material. Encode a 50 min prores 422(HQ) file, embed 8 channels of audio, then drop it in a timeline of your choice and whatever settings you want. Tell me it doesn’t beachball or take 10-20 minutes to draw the waveforms. If one works, two or three certainly will not. Work can’t be done with these types of files, which make up a ton of long form stuff. It makes sense then that this isn’t well documented, as there’s not very much long form stuff cut on FCPX, quite possibly for reasons such as this. I’ve talked to Apple, they’ve acknowledged the issue now. Test it out and you may as well.

[Bill Davis]

Let’s see, 48,000 cycles per second times 8 tracks times HOURS of content and all the software has to do is create visualizations with enough precision that the user can zoom into the subframe level anywhere they click and shuffle that data in and out of RAm so the system stays instantly responsive for the user.

Can’t imagine WHY that should take any time at all!

Particularly when the CPU and GPU(s) might also be processing video transcodes simultaneously.

Oh, and organizing everything into a user definable database to in order to store future edl decisions.

You are right, it’s stupid, unusable software and you should definitely pick something else to learn.

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.

[Chris Frantz]

I never called it stupid. It’s fine software for some use cases, just not for long form. It’s just software buddy, no need to get personally offended on its behalf. And, once again, FCP7 could handle it no problem albeit without subframe accuracy and premiere pro can handle it with subframe accuracy in just a few seconds. It’s a bug, Apple has acknowledged it. It crashes when I import broadcast ready files and try to work with them others have said similar. If you don’t have a solution, that’s ok, hopefully it will be fixed in the next release. Enjoy your weekend, relax it’s just software.

[Charlie Austin]

[Chris Frantz] “It crashes when I import broadcast ready files and try to work with them others have said similar.”

FWIW, I regularly use similar sources as you (20-120 minute clips with 6-10 channel stems mix of stereo and mono) and I don’t get crashes. It does take a while to draw the waveforms though. Hopefully this is being addressed as we speak. 🙂

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~ My FCPX Babbling blog ~
~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~
~”The function you just attempted is not yet implemented”~

[Mike Warmels]

Well, I am having a similar problem. One that is costing me loads and loads of time everyday and I suspect it’s the bloody waveform stuff on FCPX.

I have 21 XD-CAM discs from a one week shoot converted to Apple Pro Res in separate clips. I have then made 21 synchronised clips with all the separate 8-track audioclips belonging to this video. That was a bit of a hassle, a number of bugs showed up (4 out of 21 synchronised clips of 40 minutes didn’t register the 8 tracks of audio, the other clips did. (Workaround: cut them up in bits, but WHY do a few have that problem and others not???))

I have turned off the original audio, but now everytime I click on one of these synchronised clips to edit with them I get a beach ball. Sometimes 1 second, sometimes 5 or even up to 10, all day long!!! I suspect FCPX considers these synchronised clips as one big file (and not a collection of smaller separate files: video clip and 8-track audio clip). But editing with it is HORRENDOUS!!! I suspect FCPX has to check all the audio everytime I click on it: 8 tracks for 45 minutes each.

Now, I would suspect FCPX to be smart enough to see these synchronised clips as a collection of a lot of little clips. But I doubt it does. I tried to consolidate a two minute clips
and the consolidation turned out to be 78GB big. I checked the separate library I made for consolidation and noticed it had included ALL the clips from the synchronised clips from the two discs I used… in total 90 minutes of HD Apple Pro Res material. Why doesn’t it just include the two original clips I used????

Now I have had run-ins with avid FCPX fans, but I am sorry to say: the programming of FCPX is not thought through yet. And I run into that often enough. And again: synchronising clips and using them normally works fine on other NLE’s. Whenever a project gets big (like a series of six episodes and you have som 20 hours of footage, and now with synchronised audio) FCPX is slow slow slow… Final Cut SLOW would be a better name for it. I work 75% of my normal speed, the rest is just waiting for that darn beach ball.

I agree with Chris on this: you can’t work when you’re on a time schedule with the audio handling of FCPX.

(Oh I am on a 6 core MacPro trashcan, using Thunderbolt discs, local Library on internal SSD etc the works… I been through all that.)

[Joe Marler]

[Chris Frantz] “Encode a 50 min prores 422(HQ) file, embed 8 channels of audio, then drop it in a timeline of your choice and whatever settings you want. Tell me it doesn’t beachball or take 10-20 minutes to draw the waveforms. If one works, two or three certainly will not. Work can’t be done with these types of files, which make up a ton of long form stuff. “

If this is a reproducible scenario that happens on any X system under these conditions, I’d hope it would be fixed fairly quickly. When a problem is encountered on mainstream tasks, customers with enterprise support on high end products can’t be told “I’m sorry that’s just totally broken, it may be fixed in the next major version”. That is what hot fixes are for.

That in turn raises the question whether Apple distributes private FCP X hotfixes to enterprise customers. If yes why cannot other customers get those. If no, then how are those customers coping? Either way this implies there is some solution for the rest of us.

If it is *not* reproducible that implies it’s something unique to your system, which gives hope of some procedural workaround.

[Neil Goodman]

[Chris Frantz] ” never called it stupid. It’s fine software for some use cases, just not for long form. It’s just software buddy, no need to get personally offended on its behalf. And, once again, FCP7 could handle it no problem albeit without subframe accuracy and premiere pro can handle it with subframe accuracy in just a few seconds. It’s a bug, Apple has acknowledged it. It crashes when I import broadcast ready files and try to work with them others have said similar. If you don’t have a solution, that’s ok, hopefully it will be fixed in the next release. Enjoy your weekend, relax it’s just software.”

Its the usual “your holding it wrong” bs from Bill.

excuses and excuses while not actually trying to offer a solution and furthermore, denying theres a problem.

PPRO and Avid can bring in hour long clips with 16 channels of audio and guess what – it doesnt take all night or crash the program to start working the clips.

Before you launch into defense mode – why not try the other programs and realize that this indeed possible in the other apps w/o headache.

This is a bug – no if ands or buts about it.

[Bill Davis]

Just for the record. I helped Mike figure out the fix in another thread. Which started with my brain not accepting that it’s just a “bug” and therefore no solution is worth pursuing outside of waiting for Apple to “fix” things for me.

You think like you think. I think differently. Today, I (and I presume Mike) are happy about that.

; )

Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.