FCPX on MBP Retina Display – WOW

[Shawn Miller]

[Charlie Austin] “This: https://clipexporter.mindtransplant.com works really nicely.”

This doesn’t seem nearly as fast as Premiere Pro’s Dynamic Link to AE.

[Charlie Austin] “Yes, you need to go to 3rd parties to do some stuff in X (Xto7, 7toX, EDL-X, XtoPro, ClipExporter etc) But I’d honestly rather have Apple spend all their time on the actual editing software, and provide hooks and let others spend their time on the “niche” workflow stuff. I too need this “niche” stuff, but I don’t care if it it’s built in to the app, as long as it works easily, which in my experience all these apps do.”

I don’t have any objections to the way Apple chooses to provide functionality to FCPX users; third party, native support, either way works. My statement was in response to Jerry Hofmann’s acertion that FCPX is the “fastest NLE in the world”. I just don’t believe you can dismiss the impact of workflow or technical requirements so easily. Can you ingest, tag/log, edit and output projects in FCPX faster than any NLE? Maybe… doesn’t it depend on what else is involved in your workflow? Just asking.

Shawn

[Jerry Hofmann]

Not that it can’t be done. It can. But not without going through hoops until adobe reads X’s XML I’d guess. I don’t use AE. If I can’t do it in Apple’s sofware I go to an effects artist who doesn’t edit. You can nearly always export and import movies between any app.

X is the only NLE software in the world that is written in OS X native code BTW, so is the only modern Mac NLE sofware out there. The other guys have to catch up in from any perspective on that front. That gives Apple a unique position.

You’d be faster working in Motion 5 if you could use it today with X. It’s a new app from 4.5 too. But closer because it was already Cocoa. Publishing is especially forward thinking with it and X.

Currently, it’s best workflow for what many would use AE for. But not everyone obviously. I would think that if you have use AE, you’ll have great results using Premiere, in that it passes XML precisely?

I’d also submit that this issue will deminish faster than not. Third parties all over this. Phil and Greg at Int. Asst. for starters. They did what Apple stated was impossible.

It comes down to what gets the results you want the fastest way possible for the task at hand balancing a workflow. The gaol may be to give more time to serious trial and error. Or to simply render and deliver faster. Your workflow should be determined by this factor somewhat, and the rest is personal preference, which takes a serious backseat.

Learning them all is what anybody could profit from I’ll wager. LOL.

Jerry

[Charlie Austin]

[Shawn Miller] “I don’t have any objections to the way Apple chooses to provide functionality to FCPX users; third party, native support, either way works. My statement was in response to Jerry Hofmann’s acertion that FCPX is the “fastest NLE in the world”. I just don’t believe you can dismiss the impact of workflow or technical requirements so easily. Can you ingest, tag/log, edit and output projects in FCPX faster than any NLE? Maybe… doesn’t it depend on what else is involved in your workflow? Just asking.”

No argument there… I do know that the clip exporter app is much better at getting sequence info into AE from FCPX than trying to do it from FCP7. But sure, premier probably is a better choice if you need to roundtrip to AE.

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[Alban Egger]

[Shane Ross] “[Jerry Hofmann] “6. Smart collections make organization nearly automatic.”

“nearly?” Don’t you have to label things, take the time to do what it takes to put them into Smart Collections? That’s still manually organizing things.”

Nope, you don´t have to do anything else than select metadata, even if you did not label anything.
e.g. you can select all files shot by cameraA in 720p in over crank-mode from a certain range of 3 days in March with one person in it (and not 1080p25 and not 720p50 and not from before or after or any other camera). You would not have to label anything. I never use any of the auto features (I rather log the CUs, wides and 2 or 1 person shot etc myself), but it is possible to narrow down thousands of clips without ever looking at any of them VERY easily and instantly. I just tried this above example and it took me 33 seconds (small project with 500 clips, selecting 10 of 150 that were shot on that weekend).
Once you have logged and key worded your footage and even added roles, this can go very far in organizing years of material.

And about FCPX being the fastest NLE in the world….hmmm….it is on some tasks, and it is not in others. No NLE can say it is perfect, but it is clear to me when someone tried FCPX it is a huge step back to CS6 and Avid, because of the limitations of tracks and mediamanagement.
They have their advantages and they have some features that are needed for many workflows (and FCPX does miss the audio mixer among other features badly), but as an editor and mediamanager itself I take FCPX over both of them easily and it seems the number of people thinking like that is increasing.

[Jerry Hofmann]

I don’t say you should dismiss workflow considerations. I said it’s still the fastest NLE (Non Linear Editor) in the world. Making a change in a middle of a scene or a change in the scene orders themselves is typically only one click away and instant. In a track based editor it would take so much more effort if clips are running under or over said edit change. In X, you tie any given frame of an audio clip to any given frame of any video clip and they stay locked until you change that relationship in this new timeline. That’s fundamentally different than traditional timeline’s behaviors, and turns out, a lot faster during the editorial process of changing everything under the sun over and over. Fewer moves makes for faster editing, or it makes for more trial and error time. Either way, it’s better. But it is considerably faster during the process of edit decision making for anybody that seems to learn the app. I think it’s likely the easiest app to learn if you bring no notions to the workflow you use in the timeline. there are direct comparisons to the structure of organizational features otherwise.

I want better ways to edit on the fily with FCP X. That is missing. There’s lot’s missing. But I’m not forgetting FCP 1 only did DV… so think of how much more X does from the first ‘release’.

Giving up tracks gave us the ability to always link any audio and video layers to each other precisely on any given frame and sort of lock it that way. and at the same time, move it where we intend it to be no matter what I do lengthwise to any given clip in a sequence. The out of sync problem moves in a sequence have plagued NLE’s forever, in that they took too much thinking from the editor, or not enough, but it has always been cumbersome comparatively.

Jerry

[Charlie Austin]

[Shane Ross] “an AAF/OMF to an audio mixer (with tracks organized in a way that makes it easier on them, not mixed dialog and SFX and music…audio mixers DO work in tracks), “

Not to beat a dead horse, but this is soon to be a non issue..in a few weeks hopefully, an X timeline like this:

Exports to protools like this:

All split out nicely automatically. So… AAF… essentially done. EDL’s… done. Few more biggies to go and then it all comes down to personal preferences. 🙂

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[Aindreas Gallagher]

[Jerry Hofmann] “Apple has sold more copies of X than it did of Studio 3. This is more than 3 million copies. This says something. This says that there are adoptions going on all over the place, and not being talked much about. It’s not about what the 10,000 need. It’s about what the 4 million need. “

This has been said a number of times over god knows how long, but Im not sure what it means. If it means that Apple have hit the bullseye on an approachable, yet scaling to advanced editing system that may square the circle of pixelmator/whatever/elements to say photoshop, or the numerous starter editing packages to FCP/Avid/Premiere – fine. But the thrust seems to be that by distributing 299 dollar single style wallmart sales in a one off event to a (lets guess the number) large scale, that Apple have then fundamentally shifted the craft and debate, and constructed a novel, and utterly new, editing paradigm – in that case I’m not sure I see it.

“not being talked much about”

That’s an interesting phrase: not being employed, requested, sought after, or paid for in any context might be another phrase. (taught maybe).

straw in the wind here – but premiere just got two london hits this week on mandy worldwide mail list for editing – and the one the week before.

there has not been a single FCPX posting in this entire time, world wide, on this weekly list since the launch of FCPX. And this is not an application ripe to slide into general use – it near absolutely rejects almost all held practise – including its predecessor. It is nearly entirely a creation of cupertino fancy.
Schoonmaker and Murch, (of course their skill level is la-de-da and to be tea party despised as white tower) but seriously – barely any paid editors of factual, narrative and corporate across america and europe have the slightest visible truck with the connected clips, secondary storylines, non-sync detached audio gameshow.

the point ultimately is – why should anyone that comprises any element of paid professional practise twist their entire head around to look at, nevermind execute with this thing?

Given that near no one is asking them too?

– bar the street brawl on this forum? I’ve got a half respectable notion of FCPX – I honestly do not buy it.

say for my personal sins, I have spent the last two weeks, up at all hours, editing cycling and marathon highlights for venue playback at the mall and hampton court for the olympics. FCP7 still happily stands, taking a live virtual clip assembly in continuously via movie recorder control. great system. great egalitarian FCP ecosystem. An open, aspirational editing system built on common basic logic. (small wave to secondary storyline/connected clip joke logic)

nobody, (near literally) is writing cheques for the practise of FCPX – and we make our (nominal) livelihoods executing editing in software right?

are we bad to dismiss and ignore this software because we think it is badly and bizarrely made? Does this make us elitists? are the three million unseen FCPX bane men going to rise from the basement of editing gotham and slay us? for our one percent preference for intellectually thorough and consistent software?

Are we bad just to say FCPX is simply a slightly dodgy mess and good luck with that? Aren’t we in a sense partly paid to perceive and weigh this kind of software? Are we trying to destroy the fourth amendment of editing democracy here?

(on a personal adobe note, after three months plus of dialogue, my second hand upgrade to Adobe Production Premium 6.0 is now mine – never, ever try to buy second hand Adobe – it is a kafkaesque nightmare)

I vote Premiere Pro 6.0 – it looks like sense.

https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics

[Charlie Austin]

[Aindreas Gallagher] “…But the thrust seems to be that by distributing 299 dollar single style wallmart sales in a one off event to a (lets guess the number) large scale, that Apple have then fundamentally shifted the craft and debate, and constructed a novel, and utterly new, editing paradigm – in that case I’m not sure I see it…

it near absolutely rejects almost all held practise – including its predecessor. It is nearly entirely a creation of cupertino fancy…

barely any paid editors of factual, narrative and corporate across america and europe have the slightest visible truck with the connected clips, secondary storylines, non-sync detached audio gameshow…

the point ultimately is – why should anyone that comprises any element of paid professional practise twist their entire head around to look at, nevermind execute with this thing?…

(small wave to secondary storyline/connected clip joke logic)…

are the three million unseen FCPX bane men going to rise from the basement of editing gotham and slay us? for our one percent preference for intellectually thorough and consistent software?

Are we bad just to say FCPX is simply a slightly dodgy mess and good luck with that?
“

Wow. So Let me see if I can sum up… “I haven’t really used FCPX, nor has anyone I know, but I’ve read all sorts of bad things about it, and there are no job postings for it on some mailing list. Therefore, I do not like it, and FCPX is not a truly professional NLE.”

Hey, if you don’t like it, that’s fine. But you also seem to be intimating that anyone who does use, or god forbid actually *prefer* FCPX is somehow not really professional. Am I reading that correctly?

If not, what is it exactly you are trying to say? In any case… here’s my rebuttal: I am an award winning professional editor, I work with big, important movie studios on big, important movies and television shows and I like FCPX. It is great. 🙂

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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~

[Bill Davis]

[Charlie Austin] “If not, what is it exactly you are trying to say? In any case… here’s my rebuttal: I am an award winning professional editor, I work with big, important movie studios on big, important movies and television shows and I like FCPX. It is great. 🙂
“

Game. Set. Match.

“Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions.”-Justice O’Connor

[Aindreas Gallagher]

Dandy. call it out mate – call out the involved studios and shows, that’s very worth while –

I happily quoted a BBC factual editor a while back who was pitching a flag for an exclusive FCPX doco site in london. off a chat like this over at fcpx.co –

its all good.

but, to be fair, in the end, judgement will eventually be called on this software and the whole secondary/roles/connected whatever

I think its us because our nose is at the grindstone – we get to have every wrinkle at the worst possible moment.

however – if judgements on the scale you are referencing are actually happening at major studios with major projects – you really should lay that out.

that could have me instantly back at the app for the simplest bread hungry reasons.

(and I really have spent half-decent time at the app)

https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics