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Dropped Frames on Playback WHAT???
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As in high quality scrubbing?
No I have not had this problem with SD or any smaller HD same codec projects. This is the first time with this problem, and it’s with a much more complicated edit. I think Rafael might be right, it’s my system directories…Mac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
because this is the first project with this new RAID 0 installed…
Mac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
Howdy Joe,
First off all of your hardware sounds rock solid and I thinks it’s far more likely that it is a bug in FCP. There are many.
I have some questions.
How are you’re photos encoded? TIFF, JPG, PNG?
I’ve had some problems with final cut not dealing with tiff images very well.
What tools did you use to conform this footage to ProRes?
On one Project I ran into very mysterious problems which were caused by setting the After Effects setttings to 23.98 fps. There is no actual 23.98 frame rate. The ACTUAL frame rate is 23.975 and folks just got tired of saying one more digit. Also I think the final cut team was unable to add another decimal place in the app and although your sequence says 23.98, I assure you it is in fact 23.975. Anyway that one really burned me.
Have you tried repairing permissions on your System Drive and then rebooting?
This actually frequently helps.
How is your audio encoded?
MP3 = FCP hell.
Finally, sometimes projects just get wonky. I sometimes am able to fix cranky projects by the following steps:
* Create a new project with a different name
* Create a new sequence in that project with your desired settings
* Open the old sequence in the old project and hit CMD-A or drag select all
* CMD-C or Copy
* Click over to the new Sequence in the new Project and
* CMD-V or Paste
* Close the old project, render the sequence and see if that works.It doesn’t sound like this is going to affect your output so that’s good.
Good Luck!
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Hi Josh, thanks for the reply:
– Photos are mostly jpg, sized according to use. Some are tiffs, which I have had problems with. I had major issues with PNGs crashing my FCP so I avoid those at all costs. I’m also using psd files with transparency.
-I acutally haven’t had to use After Effects on this project, which is abnormal. I hear you I had that exact problem before with the framerate. Anyways, the 5DMKII was shot in 1080p30 (24p firmware came out in the middle of production so we opted to continue what we were doing instead of changing workflow half way through). What I’ve done was altered Philip Bloom’s workflow. Transcoded footage to ProRes 422 HQ with Compressor, sometimes MPeg Streamclip, then conformed to 23.976 in Cinema Tools. If I needed to retime it for audio sync I would do so with Compressor, but any B roll or shots that would be over VO I just left it. This workflow helped alot with the Jello effect and some of the aliasing inherent in the Canon HDSLRs.
I went this way because the final product looked better than the normal Transcode AND Conform with Compressor in one go. Compressor did a horrible job with predicting motion and the movement and pans were stuttery and blocky. MPeg Streamclip was fast, and the conform with Cinema Tools really made it smooth and nice looking. If I needed lipsync, then I would go to Compressor and retime that specific clip.
– Yes, I’ve repaired permissions AND tried doing a Safe Boot to try and fix any problems. It helped a little but eventually it was the same old same old.
– Audio are wav or aiff. No MP3s I’ve had those hellish problems before too.I’ve spoken to a number of friends about this. One of them, an Apple certified FCP rep, said that it is most likely the bottlenecking happening with SATA connections. Because I’m stuck at 7200 RPM 3 GB/s drives, the throughput is just not being allowed through, even though my RAID is clocking in at 190 MB/s. He is pretty sure that if I invested in a RAID controller to allow me to use an external RAID array, thus allowing me to use 10k drives at 6 GB/s, faster connection such as SAS or fiber optics, my problems would be solved.
Another thought is that my RAM and my RAID drives are all new to this project. I have to do tests to see if there are any issues with this hardware.
I also think that my directories are a bit scrambled and a little house cleaning could help. I did a test with a Quicktime output of the whole timeline, same codec and settings, brought it into a new project, streamed from my RAIDs. I only got 2 interruptions in the playback. That’s a sign for sure I think.
Let me know what you think, thanks.
JosephMac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
found the white paper for ProRes 422. Found some first hand accounts of RAID systems and ProRes. I’m pretty sure that my setup for scratch disk is not enough. Plus I’m using HQ which is pointless, 422 is sufficient by all means, especially since we shot on a 5DMKII, there isn’t enough information to warrant HQ.
422 HQ requires 220 MB/s. With my sata connection speed and RAID setup, I’m not hitting this requirement, bottleneck or not. The real question is if had a 422 project, would it be a problem?
I’m pretty much 90% confident that in order to edit online ProRes 422 HQ, I will need a RAID card and an Array, or a capture card with acceleration, to sustain read/write speeds required. Therein lies the problem. I now know better and will stick with 422 for most projects.
It’s always the obvious isn’t it? Thanks for the help everyone.
JosephMac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
Better read that white paper again… The data rate is a LOT lower than that. HQ will run on a single FW 800 drive. (one stream in it’s sleep).
Jerry
Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski. My Blog: https://blogs.creativecow.net/Jerry-Hofmann
DVD:https://store.creativecow.net/p/81/jerry_hofmanns_final_cut_system_setup
8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17″ MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays
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No! I don’t want to hear that. I see what you are saying. The comparative data rate chart lists 1080 23.976 at 176 Mbps. Damn, stumped again.
Mac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
Yeah. When is the last time you rebuilt your startup disk? It might be time.
Jerry
Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski. My Blog: https://blogs.creativecow.net/Jerry-Hofmann
DVD:https://store.creativecow.net/p/81/jerry_hofmanns_final_cut_system_setup
8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17″ MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays
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When you say rebuilt, do you mean a reinstall of OSX? It’s been awhile since I’ve done that. I thought of doing it, but I wanted to wait until this project is delivered. Luckily, I can still continue to work.
Mac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D -
SO! A week or so ago I ran some tests to determine if my RAID was dying, and everything came back hunky dory.
Yesterday afternoon, I opened up Disk Utility to verify permissions on my boot drive, and guess what I noticed? One of the 1TB Seagates in the RAID 0 was highlighted red. It has a hardware problem and cannot be fixed. It seems this drive has been dying for awhile but hasn’t reached critical yet so no app was able to catch it. I’ve been running with a bum leg it appears.
I hope this solves the issue. And the fact that I’m about to build my own DIY RAID 5 8TB external array with a dedicated hardware RAID card. That should put this whole beast to bed.
Thanks everyone for the support and suggestions. I love this forum.
JosephMac 2.66 GHz Quad Intel Xeon
OSX 10.6.4
FCP 7.0.2
AE CS4
Quicktime Pro 7.6.4
8GB RAM
2x1TB RAID O (All Media Scratch Disk)
Blackmagic Intensity Pro
ATI Radeon X1900
Panasonic Lumix GH1, Panasonic HVX200A, Panasonic DVX100A, Canon 5DMKII, 7D
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