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After a year has perception of FCPX changed?
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[Andy Neil] “I’m hoping to try and change the minds of the people I work with about FCPX, but it’s slow going. Most of the people who have bitched to me about FCPX haven’t even tried it. That’s pretty much the definition of a stigma. We just disagree on how fast it’ll go away.”
Waaayyy back in November of 2011, I did some Cow research on the release of the first FCP and what people we’re saying back then, mostly in terms of cost, and any effect it might be having on Avid editors.
If you have the time, I suggest reading the post from the list of links. It gives us over a decade of perspective.
It is sometimes uncanny how cyclical this whole situation appears to be.
https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/21677
Jeremy
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One issue that seems to be missed is the one that has kept me from pursuing FCPX.
I am a one man show. I write, shoot and edit. Even though it is my favorite part of the process, I have only so much time to spend on editing. It has taken me years to get where I am in terms of skill in FCP. There is a lot to learn and tutorials & books get you only so far. You just can’t remember everything. It takes hands on work in the NLE and with each passing year I got better and better.
Right or wrong, my perception of FCPX is that I would need to pretty much start from scratch. So it would be a good five years before I was at a skill level I now enjoy in FC Legacy no matter the features it offers. This is because there is just so much I can retain from any teaching tool and it would take hands on work to pick up certain skill sets.
I have PPRO 5.5, but when it comes right down to it, I have pretty much stuck with FC7 because I want to get the project done. Now that I see raw video in my future, I may be forced out of FC Legacy. But I tend to aim towards Premiere because I feel I won’t lose all of the years of learning I have invested. I may be mistaken, but I feel going with FCPX means I am starting pretty much at zero.
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I do think there’s an inherent benefit for Apple in continuing to develop software like Aperture, Logic, and FCPX. Apple’s pro-apps have long been testbeds for bringing consumer-facing versions of those features to the iLife suite- which is given away free on all new Macs- a selling feature they’ve pushed since the resurgence of the Mac platform in the early 2000’s. And now on iOS as well.
I’m not sure what anyone is smoking who thinks high end Macs are going away. As long as Apple wants people developing for their platform… Apple will keep the Mac alive and vibrant. A venn diagram of people who think FCPX is abandoning Pros, and those that think a “MacPro” replacement aren’t coming probably has a huge overlap. And honestly, if someone has those concerns, then they should absolutely move on to another platform. ‘Cause while Apple is giving us peaks into FCPXs 2012 roadmap, they’ll NEVER provide guidance on their hardware plans. And I’d be surprised if Apple even kept up the “sneak peaks” long term.
Right now they’re just affirming the upcoming reintegration of previous functionality. But once all the big holes are filled and they’re stretching out into whatever new territory they have planned, I’d imagine our window will close.
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[Bill Davis] “If I get passionately “heavy handed” in my arguments, everyone here must expect some of that from me by now. And at least I’m consistent! ; )”
Indeed but when you say
“But I still content that most of the people who “hate” X, seem to me to be largely driven by frustrations based around how it’s “forcing” them consider changing away from a work style and habits they’ve been comfortable with for a decade.”,
then expect me and other to call you for it. It isn’t true in my experience or many others but you repeat it without foundation. -
[Marcus Moore] “I’m not sure what anyone is smoking who thinks high end Macs are going away.”
Probably nothing near as good as whatever it is you are smoking.
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Tou…ché…?
Wow, compelling debate. Here, let me meet you part way…
Could I see the MacPro going away? Absolutely. But not functional hole that it fills.
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[Marcus Moore] “Tou…ché…?
Wow, compelling debate. Here, let me meet you part way…
Could I see the MacPro going away? Absolutely. But not functional hole that it fills.
“Sorry. I wasn’t trying for compelling debate, because you weren’t debating. You were simply insulting people who, for a variety of reasons, have serious doubts about Apple’s commitment to workstations. I was simply returning the favor. Sometimes “I know you are, but what am I?” is all a comment requires.
If you look around this forum you’ll see that this is a much-discussed topic. There are certainly people who agree with you, and some of them make fairly good arguments. Many of them believe that Apple will release, if not a mini MacPro, then a iMacPro. I’d be happy to think this is the case, but I see a lot of evidence to the contrary, and am not counting on such a thing to happen. From my perspective, Apple has missed far too many moments to introduce a new MacPro, and has made far too many statements about being a post-PC company for anyone to feel secure that they plan to continue with any kind of workstation. Add to that that workstations are an utterly insignificant part of their revenue, and that the company has aggressively touted a form of cloud computing that breaks their traditional echo system, I’m really not expecting Apple to come out with any kind of heavy hitter. As I’ve said in the past, I’d be delighted to be wrong, but as each opportunity to update their current line of heavy hitters passes by without remark, my doubt grows. Frankly, as inconvenient as it might be for me personally, I think it is probably a better choice for them not to. So, that’s what I’m smoking.
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I think it speaks to a larger, dare I say philosophical?, question of what a workstation is. You go back even 5 years and the processing advantage between a MacPro and an iMac was miles apart. Now you see demos of people working with 4K material on a MacBook Air via Thunderbolt. So I think part of my thought process is that the old tropes that some people hold up are becoming more irrelevant by the day. In fact, if 1080p were to be any kind of long-term standard, then I’d almost say we could see the horizon where processor power might catch up with demand. But with RAW 4K looming on the horizon for a broader slice of the market, I no longer think we’ll see the ceiling anytime soon.
Now obviously sheer processor power only gets you so far. Render farms or high end graphics and color suites DO benefit from a 12core machine with 64GB of ram and multiple GPUs. I’m putting my money on Thunderbolt to be the solution. It isn’t now (though man those transfer speeds come in handy!) but I don’t think we’re too far off from a TB capable of enough lanes to support a breakout box that can handle all the stuff that we shove into a PCI slot. I’d wager that Apple won’t even make that breakout mini tower of power, but it will be there for those who have that need. And once you can outbound that, then the user can buy ANY Mac and it can be a workstation device.
If I had to bet, I’d say we will see one final TB MacPro, simply because TB isn’t fast enough yet. But I agree that if it’s going to happen it will have to happen soon. The natives are restless.
That’s what I’m smoking.
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[Bill Davis] “Hi Walter!”
Howdy, Bill. Many thanks for your kind words here, as well as for meeting up with me, Moody, and Jeff at NAB. It was really great to shake hands, put faces with names, and get to know one another better.
[Bill Davis] “I remember the UVW 1800! One of my early clients gave me one so that I could narrate their local Real Estate show for local TV show using it. I remember it was very finicky as to Sync, and it took me a week to figure out a way to fake a black burst signal so the damn thing would record as a standalone unit!”
The UVW-1800 lacked the feature set of the gold standard BVW-75, but it also lacked the price tag, putting deck ownership in the range of motivated individuals instead of just facilities. In my mind, this was the first shot of what became known as the DV revolution, but which was really just our niche’s segment of the good-enough revolution [link], where “broadcast quality” softened to “broadcast format” before dissolving altogether. Vilfredo Pareto [link] is one tenacious bastard.
I think the VX1000 and FCP v1 just followed in the UVW-1800’s footsteps, and I think FCPX is the evolutionary continuation of that trend.
[Bill Davis] “And by all means please keep pushing me on the places where you see things differently.”
I think most of the times we disagree are precisely because we see things differently. Among the contributors on this forum, there’s huge diversity in perspective, because there’s huge diversity in market, specialty, input, work product, skill set, business structure, budget, schedule, partners, and clients.
Since you, Aindreas, Andrew, Chris, Craig, David, Jeremy, Jules, Lance, Michael, Steve, Tony, and I all do such different work (along with the host of other contributors and readers here), it shouldn’t come as a surprise that we all see something different when we look at FCPX.
What’s more surprising to me, in retrospect, was that we all saw something so similar when we looked at FCP7.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Jeremy Garchow] “Waaayyy back in November of 2011…”
That’s like 3.5 “FCPX or Not” years.
[Jeremy Garchow] “I did some Cow research on the release of the first FCP and what people we’re saying back then, mostly in terms of cost, and any effect it might be having on Avid editors. If you have the time, I suggest reading the post from the list of links. It gives us over a decade of perspective. It is sometimes uncanny how cyclical this whole situation appears to be.”
Great links. I encourage everyone to re-read them.
On the general topic, I think it’s critical to remember that these products all evolve, and we need to be willing to re-evaluate them periodically.
When FCP v1 came out, some people said that it was the future, and other people said it wasn’t as good as Avid. They were both right.
When Avid came out, some people said it was the future, and other people said it wasn’t as good as a CMX. They were both right.
When the UVW-1800 came out, some people said it was the future, and other people said it wasn’t as good as BVW-75. They were both right.
What we see today (or what we saw a year ago) might not be valid another year from now. I think most of us here believe this, and it’s why we are still here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6E4Oy6pFKQ
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
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