AE vs Smoke

[Todd Kopriva]

It should come as no surprise to anyone that I’m reading this and taking notes. 😉

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Todd Kopriva, Adobe Systems Incorporated
product manager, professional video software
After Effects team blog
Premiere Pro team blog
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[Walter Soyka]

[Richard Cardonna] “It would not be to far off to think that autodesk has seen this relation and now with a 3d tracker 3d extrution in A/E what is to stop Adobe from including more 3d stuff like 3dcomp all they got to do is add PS vanishing point to A/E and you got a few notches over smoke just there.”

Even with the addition of the 3D renderer in CS6, the AE ecosystem has a way to go before it matches Smoke’s 3D compositing. There are many effects for AE that focus on simulating 3D in a 2.5D system. These ought to be rewritten to actually work in 3D space. Imagine an effect like Shatter or Particular. These plugins include their own 3D renderer that matches the camera comp but does not actually allow you to integrate true geometry or depth in the scene. In 3D compositing, you shouldn’t have to worry about occlusion layers or clipping paths to integrate two objects into a scene.

[Richard Cardonna] “Can you imagine A/E with smoke capabilities on a highend HP/Promax it would really smoke.”

I don’t have to imagine it. I use AE on a high-end HP every day. It does smoke (no pun intended).

The global performance cache feature in the upcoming CS6 release is a big deal, and I think it will be a huge performance boost for most heavy AE users.

[Richard Cardonna] “So I ask what else besides this would a/e need to qualify as a smoke killer? Am I reading to much into this? “

I don’t think you’re comparing the right products. AE will never be a Smoke killer by itself — but Production Premium might be. Aside from the compositing differences I have already mentioned, I think the big differences between Production Premium and Smoke are philosophical and stem from the histories of the products.

In a way, though, with Smoke 2013, Autodesk is actually taking a page out of the Adobe Production Premium playbook. Production Premium puts Premiere Pro as the hub in the center of the workflow, flowing back and forth with Pl, Ps, Ai, Ae, Au, and Sg. Smoke 2013 moves the context for effects away from the Edit Desk as it had been in previous versions, and right into the timeline itself. There’s still the difference of the super-app versus the suite, and the historical focus on finishing versus the historical focus on creating, but the new timeline-centric model will be more familiar for anyone with desktop NLE experience.

Premiere Pro has made huge strides in usability and performance. If Adobe keeps tightening integration and improving performance as they have been doing over the last few releases, and if they pay attention to offline/online interchange, media management, color management, and perhaps native DI codec support, I think that Production Premium will be a viable contender for high-end finishing work.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events

[Richard Cardonna]

Thanks Walter I have a clearer picture now. I will wait till Adobe makes A/E more super than its now.

Richard

[Shawn Miller]

[Walter Soyka] “If Adobe keeps tightening integration and improving performance as they have been doing over the last few releases, and if they pay attention to offline/online interchange, media management, color management, and perhaps native DI codec support, I think that Production Premium will be a viable contender for high-end finishing work.”

This statement reminded me of a 2008 blog post from Stu Maschwitz.

https://prolost.com/blog/2008/10/1/what-should-adobe-do-with-premiere-pro.html

Very interesting in the context of this discussion, and the upcoming CS6 and Smoke 2012 release. 🙂

Shawn

[Roland R. kahlenberg]

Paradoxically, how the related Adobe apps work together is going to be crucial in determining the adoption rate, hence success, of the individual products.

Here’s a very good video from Karl Le Soule – Dynamic Linking in CS6 apps./

While the ease with which DL is invoked is a huge step in the right direction, the fact that AE and PPro do not share the same render engine is a huge bottleneck. There is also no clear indication as to how best to work between AE and PPro. While this may be a good idea, for the majority of users, this may actually lead to unproductive practices to creep into their workflow and lead to unhappiness with using the products. Unfortunately, there is a dearth of online tutorials/courses that cover this subject thoroughly.

While I’ve not had hands-on use on Smoke, I’ve spent close to 100 hours, providing AE training to two groups of Smoke users. It was largely unanimous, from the students’ POV, that AE’s feature-set (including 3rd party plugins) surpasses what Smoke offers.

Smoke’s prowess is in its speed as well as all-in-one package. Its 3D capabilities are not as powerful as AE’s. Add in Expressions and the amount of online as well as classroom training available for Adobe products, it’s actually not difficult to see that AE+PPro should be ahead of the curve for intricate work. I, off course, have major issues with how easy it is to obtain an Adobe certification these days – so I cannot vouch for individual trainers nor training centers.

However, for mid-end, quality type of work, Smoke’s features, speed and all-in-one design should give it the edge.

Cheers
RoRK

Intensive AE & Mocha Training in Singapore and Malaysia
Adobe ACE/ACI (version 7) & Imagineer Systems Inc Approved Mocha Trainer

[Richard Cardonna]

Thanks for the info. It looks like ppro is aiming for fcp/avid and A/E to autodesk. Kinda makes you wish CS7.0 was here

Richard C

[Dermot Shane]

smack is missing;

1) a real world color toolset whole and complete…. there’s nothing to come close to SpeedGrade
2) 3D trackers, making it’s 3D comp tools more a talking point than a real tool