10.0.6 a significant turning point.

[Jeremy Garchow]

Me too.

We are all winners here.

[Christian Fitzpatrick]

Hey Keith,

We have just started testing MetaSAN with FCPX and we are definitely not getting any kind of result where FCPX tells us that another user is currently using the SAN location – at this time it would appear that we are very easily we are able to corrupt projects, obviously when they are simultaneously mounted on different machines – but worryingly, even when adding and removing the san location, exiting FCPX and then adding, editing and removing again on another machine.

Sometimes changes appear when made on the second machine, sometimes they don’t.

What sort of SAN system are you using? and would you be willing to share your exact workflow for this here – we really need to get this sorted as project sharing is a complete disaster here at the moment. 🙂

Hope you can help mate,

Christian

[Keith Koby]

Hi Christian,

We haven’t tried (intentionally) to add a san location that is already open and in use in 10.0.6, but I’ll test that when I get to the office today. And we haven’t passed a whole lot of projects back and forth with 10.0.6.

We are running a good old fashioned xsan volume (with xsan controllers). It’s good that the app recognizes metasan as a san and lets you add san locations. It’s really bad that you have the ability to add a san location at the same time. It sounds as if sometimes, you aren’t really getting read write access to the db files and not writing the record that says a particular user on a particular station has control. Are you logging in as different users on the different stations?

The only issue that we’ve seen post update is that the import window doesn’t show the contents of one of our volumes unless we unbind our OD and leave just AD binding. (golden triangle)

The one workflow in production at this time is relatively simple… Setup project on one station (import media, make 3D compound clips, format timeline etc), then, remove san location. Open san location on a second computer, play it down on the 3D monitor and surround sound setup, add elements, cut and fix. Then we export. We’ve forgone rendering and just play down during edit without rendering wherever possible. Export rendering (rendering on exporting a master file) has been really great so far in 10.0.6 – super fast.

I hope that helps. We are working on converting other workflows now that involve lots of graphics compositing and green screen. We are actually rebuilding some 3D animations that were created in AE over in motion to see if it’s possible to make them “drop zoned” and then saved as fcp x templates. The objective is to create templates for this particular workflow where everything could be done inside of fcp x.

Keith Koby
Sr. Director Post-Production Engineering
iNDEMAND NETWORKS
Howard TV!/Movies On Demand/iNDEMAND Pay-Per-View/iNDEMAND 3D

[Jeremy Garchow]

I use metaSAN and fcpx.

You need to use ProjectStore with metaSAN.

It’s easy and prevents mounting multiple SAN Locations on multiple machines. Requires v5 of metaSAN.

[Jeremy Garchow]

[Christian Fitzpatrick] “What sort of SAN system are you using? and would you be willing to share your exact workflow for this here – we really need to get this sorted as project sharing is a complete disaster here at the moment. 🙂
“

I sort of wrote about it here:

https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/38998

Jeremy

[Christian Fitzpatrick]

Hey Keith,

Thanks for the informative reply. Maybe us using MetaSAN and not an official XSAN setup is cause for the problem. Perhaps MetaSAN support for FCPX is lacking. . .I’m not sure, but either way it’s a real pain for us. I am trying to have one central Event and Project directory to archive content in – i was of the misunderstanding that adding a SAN location would allow you to pull just one event or project out of that location at a time. Dickhead me *rollseyes*.

I have setup the MetaSAN ProjectStore, but the only way I see this working is mounting our other main SAN location with all our events and projects in it, moving the Project (and referenced event) from there to the Project store, working on it, then moving it back. At least if it’s all moved within FCPX, then the unique identifiers for the project database etc. are kept intact. However I have no idea whether this will yet work. . .still testing that one.

Very Interested to see what happens if two users try and mount the same SAN location on your system Keith. Please do let me know if you can. Thanks.

Jeremy, how exactly are you utilising ProjectStore in your workflow and are you handing off projects to other editors to make changes on other machines?

Thanks so much guys, your experience and assistance with this really is invaluable. I do love FCPX, but there is only person in Australia who is a so called Apple Certified FCPX Professional and when I mentioned the word SAN, he really had no idea. . .

Thanks again.

Christian

[Jeremy Garchow]

[Christian Fitzpatrick] ” I am trying to have one central Event and Project directory to archive content in – i was of the misunderstanding that adding a SAN location would allow you to pull just one event or project out of that location at a time.”

An Event or Project can only be written to by one user at a time.

A San Location is literally a folder. It can be any folder at any level on your SAN.

You can load as many as you want at any given time.

Having one central Event and Project San Location would be the equivalent of having every single fcp7 project open at one time on your machine, i.e. not very practical.

[Christian Fitzpatrick] “I have setup the MetaSAN ProjectStore, but the only way I see this working is mounting our other main SAN location with all our events and projects in it, moving the Project (and referenced event) from there to the Project store, working on it, then moving it back. At least if it’s all moved within FCPX, then the unique identifiers for the project database etc. are kept intact. However I have no idea whether this will yet work. . .still testing that one.”

Please let me know a little but more about how you envision your fcpx projects being structured, and how you have them structured now.

With fcp7, there was generally one place for media. Of course ou didn’t have to work this way, but each project had a folder in the “Final Cut Documents” folder. Fcpx works completely differently. Once you can grasp this difference, you will see that it’s perhaps not so much of a “disaster”, but as with any shared workflow it takes planning and thought.

You don’t have to have one SAN Location per machine and put all the Events and Porjects in there. You can have as many as you want for whatever fits your workflow, and mount that SAN Location anywhere.

Xsan is different because it locks users out on a file level, and fcpx understands those permissions. With metasan, you have to use ProjectStore to “lockout” users from overwriting each other.

Fcpx will not mount read only “volumes” so if one user has a ProjectStore volume checked out and someone tries to mount it on another machine, X throws a warming saying it cannot be done. This is good as you don’t want corruption,

[Christian Fitzpatrick] “Jeremy, how exactly are you utilising ProjectStore in your workflow and are you handing off projects to other editors to make changes on other machines?”

Dismount the San Location, return to the ProjectStore Volume to the system. On the other machine, mount the ProjectStore volume, and then add it as a San Location in fcpx.

Once you have added a location once, fcpx seems to remember it, so fcpx will mount the ProjectStore volumes automatically once remembered provided they have read and write capabilities.

If you tell us a little but more about your workflow, I can try and get more specific to your situation.

Have you used a San at all with any other nle in the past?

[Morten Carlsen]

We love FCPx and that since the start… However, I do agree that we are reaching a turning point, which I dont like..

The overall stability of 10.0.6 is the worst since its initial release. We had to drop back to PPRO on certain projects because FCPx is so erratic.
Using 2 monitors is more or less a complete no go if you want to maintain your skimmer…

Handles are not acting correctly when setting them back to defaults… The last frame goes black although set to defaults.
Effects’ keyframes are set one keyframe further left than playhead.
Compound clips keep exhibiting black frames when used inside a project.
Relinking Project files has an enormous bug which will cause all sorts of havoc when sharing projects…

Since 10.0.6 — I have personally reported beyond 100 new bugs… All which I can re=create 100% and that on 3 different systems running 3 different OS X…

10.0.6 sports great features but its overall stability isnt even worth a beta state… I feel like a beta tester. And I dont like that one bit 🙂

That said,, FPCx is the also the most advance NLE the world has ever seen… We just need to get those nasty bugs ironed out ! So keep feedbacking Apple… The DO listen and respond !