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Music theft
I wasn’t sure where to post this question on the COW boards, but I’m sure every one of you have touched this issue at some point…
Using commercial music in your videos – are millions of people getting away with copyright infringement on the Youtube and Vimeo sites? Almost every video I check out on there has some hip hop or pop tune included… some actually list the name of the song and artist as though that helps… did I miss something or is this completely infringement? I know there’s probably some royalty free stuff mixed in there, and I’m not sure how much music is provided under the “creative commons” license structure (my guess is not much). What’s going on here?
There’s a ton of music that would fit my projects in mood and I’d love to use it, but I’m a professional and a professional artist at that, who relies on the copyright structure to protect my IP… but if I use some lame elevator Muzack to be legit and legal, my stuff will “appear” amature next to the billions of other projects that lifted commercial tunes. Am I alone here?
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14 Replies
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No you are not alone John…
When i started in this business several years ago, i
seriously made the decision that no form of copyrighted
material (music or video) will ever be in my work…..
because there are tons of websites offering anything you
can think off royalty free online for sale at prices
that are really affordable and some really cheap…..
And what i cant find online i design…lolSteve Rhoden
(Cow Leader)
Creative Arts Director and Film Maker.
Portfolio at:
http://www.youtube.com/hentys -
I too made that same decision and have lost work because of it. The potential clients have gone elsewhere to someone who is willing to use popular songs in their work. I can’t morally do so as it violates my conscience and is illegal to boot!
And as Steve says, there are tons of other options out there, they just won’t be “known” options unless you happen to own a recording studio that produces chart topping hits 🙂
j razz
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I would think that informing a potential client that stealing copywritten music and or video could lead to really expensive costs downstream would be enough to get them to listen to the alternatives you propose. You may feel a moral imperative. They will surely feel a financial one.
Rick Wise
director of photography
and custom lighting design
Oakland, CA
https://www.RickWiseDP.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/rwise
email: Rick@RickWiseDP.com -
For over twenty years I’ve been telling clients that they cannot use copyrighted materials in their productions. For twenty years many have listened, but some have not. A few got into trouble for it. Today, they figure that if their production is only going to be seen in-house; i.e. for corporate hoo-haws only, and not the general public or a sales team, then they feel justified in using copyrighted materials (music, songs, images, etc). It’s when their productions become available to the general public do they finally wise up and go the route of either: A) Trying to get permission for use of a copyrighted piece (this can cost up to $100,000); B) using library music (there is a HUGE amount of great production music which is quite affordable); or C) hiring a composer to create something of a similar nature to the piece they were originally stealing. If you are losing clients because you refuse to use copyrighted materials, then you are not doing a good enough job of offering alternatives. The goal here is twofold: get paid to do work, and to do it legally. In that order.
Cheers.
jmm in STL
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I get you guys and feel the same way – I will never jeopardize my business by breaking the law, whether that loses me clients or not… but what I’m getting at here, and what actually has me bothered, is the overwhelming amount of lifted tunes appearing on the video sharing sites. These sites (Youtube/Vimeo/etc.) all have disclaimers about using copyrighted materials, but don’t seem to be policing them – obviously if somebody places “music, of course, by U2” in the credits of their video. Maybe I’m wrong, maybe they paid for some royalty free “U2” song… but I doubt it. It’s this that has me confused – did I miss some new legislation? Is it really ok now to use commercial tunes in your video and post online if you’re not using it for a “commercial” purpose?
It’s funny, I posted this same question on another forum that is perhaps less professional populated and more amatuer/craft/hobby in nature, and nobody is replying to it there – plenty have viewed it…
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John, I stand to be corrected but I think that YouTube has struck deals with some of the various reocrd labels to allow the use of copyright music on the site.
I know that, over the past few weeks, one of my kids has been “complaining” that the clip she wants to watch has no music.
Had she bothered to read the disclaimer, she would’ve discovered that it was pulled at the request of the record label so they are policing it, as least to a limited extent. -
Labels don’t make agreements with YouTube; Publishers do.
Some publishers have made agreements with YouTube, but the YouTube auto-sniffers are also *very* easy to thwart if you know what you’re doing.In any event, posting credits doesn’t mean squat for keeping things legal. All it does is tell people from whom you stole the content.
Putting “Bloody Sunday by U2” in your credits merely acknowledges that you’re aware of who owns the song, which could make it easier to prove a criminal case. Make no mistake; using copyrighted music is now a criminal as well as civil offense.Douglas Spotted Eagle
VASSTCertified Sony Vegas Trainer
Aerial Camera/Instructor -
In response to the OP – no, the music on YouTube is most likely illegal.
That said, Wedding Videographers are not yet on the RIAA radar, but since they decided to stop suing children and grandma’s this could change.
But you said: “A few got into trouble for it.” Are you referring to corporate video or wedding video?
Steve Mann
MannMade Digital Video
http://www.mmdv.com -
But you said: “A few got into trouble for it.” Are you referring to corporate video or wedding video?
I did? I know nothing personally about who has been busted and what that entails, though I’ve read about content being removed at the request of the copyright holder… and a few cases of Indy film makers having to cough up cash after their films had been shown and done well.
I think the corporate clients are keeping things legit – they have liability. Plenty of wedding videos appear on the sharing sites with commercial music, and I’m sure most of the rest of the videos out there in the world that have been produced for brides and grooms contain their favorite pop tunes – those photographers/videographers are just smart enough not to publish them online (unless the bride and groom figure out how to do that…). In all honesty, if a bride and groom hand over CD’s of music that they bought (I know they don’t technically own the music) and want their images and video overlaid with this, I think there should be nothing wrong with that – they would most likely play that music on their stereo while they ran a slide show. Trying to charge them for a “performance” license is ridiculous and impossible to police. Extending that penalty to the photog/videog that mixed it with their software is stupid as well. Just my opinion.
Anyway, I think this is all quite simple – it’s just that most people are not aware of copyright. They all have free movie software on their new computers and they start uploading. I’ve been fighting to educate people about copyright uses of my photography forever… people just don’t get it – or worse, they just don’t care.
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I think Stephen was thinking of Jim’s reply that a few clients he knew got in trouble for it. I do a lot of social videography and we’re happy to use music that the clients own and bring to us. As you said, it’s essentially a legal “backup” of material that they own that they aren’t distributing. The only time I recall putting a video on youtube was of a bride and groom’s first dance where the band played a two song medley, but I imagine wedding bands are allowed to play pop songs? If they aren’t then that’s a whole other problem entirely. We’re very careful not to use copyrighted material in our demo material or for any corporate clients. I’ve gotten some pretty nice music from the DeWolfe library.
I know Warner Brothers has their music pulled from youtube videos, but currently most companies are letting 14 year olds get away with posting their skateboard videos to youtube with a Greenday song on it. I don’t personally have a moral obligation to that, and if the artists want to chase down their fans then I guess the market will decide if that’s a great strategy or not.
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