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down converting HD footage, sequence settings
I’m cutting DVC PRO HD footage for this project, but the client wants it ultimately delivered as full frame 4:3 SD DVD. Thought it would be better to keep the compression at DVCPRO HD 720p60 when I created a new 4:3 sequence, but oddly I get red render bars if I do. This can be a big pain since I have a lot of graphics I need to add on the SD sequence. So I tried it with the compression set to DV/DVC Pro and I only the green render bar so I can at least work with the graphics and see what’s going on without rendering every adjustment.
However, I’m afraid that I’ll be losing image quality by using this DV sequence before sending out to DVD Studio Pro? Should I keep it on the DVCPRO HD 720p60 compression setting? Or is there no difference?
Thanks for any insight.scott
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9 Replies
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Just edit in DVCPRO HD, then use Compressor to create your downcoverted SD MPEG-2 asset
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the problem is that I have many graphics, animations etc that need to be dropped in to the SD frame first. Must make sure they are positioned well and in title safe, etc.
scott -
Edit in DVCPro HD, including the graphics. Make sure the graphics are protected for 4:3.
If you have access to an AJA Kona board, make the downconversion in realtime .
If you don’t have access to an AJA Kona board, then export your Sequence and use Compressor to make your SD file from the HD original and crop off the video to 4:3.
This is not nearly as clean as using an AJA Kona board, but it will do a decent job.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
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thanks for the advice.
The graphics are already almost done and built by a graphic designer in Photoshop and are SD size. So if I use them in the HD sequence they are scaled up and the distorted to fit the HD frame. They are in place and look ok but obviously don’t extend out to the edges. I feel like I’m just asking for trouble if i try to edit all the graphics in the HD frame.
Instead i have opened a SD sequence and dropped in the footage (which was framed for 4:3) now I want to add the SD graphics and be able to see if all looks in place.
I’m just surprised that I’m getting a red render bar when I keep the compressor setting ion the SD sequence to the native of the footage.
Like I mentioned in the first post, that doesn’t happen if I make the compression set to DV. But I’m worried I’ll be losing quality if I set it to DV.
Any thoughts on this notion?
scott -
You may want to ask the client what users they expect to still have 4:3 displays. If they are not absolutely sure, you may want to think about delivering an anamorphic/16:9 dvd.
We used to send out 4:3 LBX’d DVD’s until we realized that NONE of our clients were watching our DVD’s on 4:3 TV’s! It was all 16:9 LCD’s and 16:10 computer screens. Our desire to produce a “standard” 4:3 DVD (LBX’d or not) was working against us.
So, now it’s anamorphic all the way.
It looks better, especially compared to a 16:9 TV showing a LBX’d and PBX’d image. Or even worse, a 16:9 TV showing a PBX’d image expanded (by the TV itself) to fill the 16:9 screen. Or a 4:3 image stretched to fill a 16:9 screen. Or, again, even worse – a 4:3 image expanded to fill a 16:9 screen. No wonder clients get confused!
Plus, no moving your graphics or recompressing – you can go straight to DVDSP!
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believe me I tried to convince them. but they insisted on shooting in HD and deliver 4:3 full screen. I warned them of possible snafus and I knew it would be a bit of a pain when it came to graphics.
I ran a test, where I put on a DVD two of the same clips, one exported from the DV sequence and one from the DVC PRO HD sequence. And I just can’t tell the difference. Compressor is taking a long time to convert just a 20 second clip, so I wonder if it is still drawing the native image quality of the footage even when it was cut on a DV timeline.
Since I only get green render bars on the DV timeline, I’m thinking that I will edit the graphics and the rest of the project where I can see minor edits without rendering. Then, once final is approved drop the whole thing back on a DVC PRO HD timeline and render one last time, thinking that I should get back to the better native compression codec, before exporting to Compressor
Pls lmk know if this sounds flawed. -
I regularly go from DVCPRO HD to DV-NTSC, no one ever complains.
I have used FCP and our Deck (HD-SDI EE’d to Firewire).Maybe I’m missing something, but once you have edited the SD timeline with graphics and such I wouldn’t bother going back to HD just so you can export once again at SD. DVCPROHD is a nice format but it includes pixel stretching, not doing your picture any real favors.
My opinion – take your DVCPROHD timeline, strip the offending graphics, export as a self-contained file. Drop this file on a DV-NTSC timeline (or an UC/ProRes SD timeline if you are really concerned about quality). Add your graphics in SD, render, export.
If your graphics are too intertwined to rip them out you could try just copy/pasting from the HD to a SD timeline, but watch your audio keyframes and your image sizes/aspects.
Best practice would probably be to duplicate your HD timeline (protect your original), create a 4:3 overlay to guide your graphic placement on the HD timeline and then export that to SD, NOT preserving aspect ratio (chopping the sides off).
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thanks for the insight. thought going back to HD after the cutting in SD probably wasn’t going to help much. will stick with cutting in this DV Ntsc sequence. i bit too late to redo the graphics to work within the HD frame with the guides. Don’t want the ones already made scaled up.
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I don’t have much call for downsizing HD to SD, but I do have to do it occasionally. So I appreciate the real-world experience that is behind this thread.
[walter biscardi] “If you don’t have access to an AJA Kona board, then export your Sequence and use Compressor to make your SD file from the HD original and crop off the video to 4:3.”
Can Compressor crop an HD image to 14:9 also? I want to deliver a 16:9 show in a way that preserves at least some of the original aspect ratio, while still making the image reasonably big on a 4:3 screen.
I have several programs on a PC that I haven’t used for years (Digital Rapids, with a DR card; and ProCoder). Where does Compressor stand in relation to those programs for downsizing?
Bob C
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